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View Full Version : Completion Rate -vs- High Score?


LLC2003
04-20-2009, 02:57 PM
Okay, I had to get this off my chest so I thought I would say it here.

At the moment, I work full time, have a small beautiful family and only get to play 360 for around 7-8 max per week. I take great pride in my Gamerscore and even though it's never going to win any high-score leaderboards I aim to achieve 100% gamerscore completion. This for me would be better than topping the leaderboard.

As quite an achievement newbie I have had to rebuy previous titles (stuntman, virtua tennis...etc) to capture the remaining achievements I overlooked before. This process means I can spend literally weeks trying to finish off a game while most people do it in 2-3 days. To achieve the elusive 100% completion I will be spending a lot of time with older games (blue dragon, splinter cell, gow1) while all the new releases will unfortunately pass me by.

Now for the semi-rant - after putting in this time in to get the full score I get really ticked off when I look at some peoples gamercard and it's littered with cheap games such as Naruto, Open Season and such others. This shows to me that the person who has played these games are playing them purely for the score and really gain no real sense of 'achievement' once completed.

What also gets me frustrated is when you look at players gamercard and they have 60-70 games played and only 4 or 5 games completed! In my opinion both of these scenarios show no real skill, they simply give up when the going get's tough or don't want to spend hours collecting 200 pigeons (for example). I find this frustrating as the gamerscore system should reflect much better the players who DO put in the time to complete games fully. The Seriously achievement picture is a great example of this.

This is not the case for everyone and many people who post on this site really go that extra mile to complete the game fully. I respect all of you.

For me me completing the games fully is much more satisfying than looking at a 100K plus gamerscore. For many players the higher the score the better the player but personally I think the achievement system is flawed. It should be re-looked at to allow players who put the time in to be recognised in other than a number, mabye something which is noticeable when you click on view profile.

I am not sure if I am by myself in this opinion so I would love to hear some of your views...

Rant over... thank you for listening.

DarkTharen
04-20-2009, 03:07 PM
I would just say be careful about who you judge with a low completion rating. I recently participated in a Gamer Score League. In that league it is about putting up the most points in a week and not necessarily your completion ratinng. I have a bunch of games on my list that now the GSL is over I am going to go back and try to complete. But even then it is a balance because who doesnt like to play some new titles when they come out?

Qavala
04-20-2009, 03:09 PM
I agree with you. Completionists get girls. Fo' Sho'.

:D

Wreckon Dracgon
04-20-2009, 03:11 PM
Ohhh where to start... first let me say I'm guessing less than three hours and :locked

I get really ticked off when I look at some peoples gamercard and it's littered with cheap games such as Naruto, Open Season and such others. Why does it bother you at all what other people play?

Second you have Shrek and two Pinatas in your tag :confused:

Now this topic has been discussed countless times and the threads do not last long before it is just a flame fest, and gets locked. Before that happens let me say, you should play games for yourself and no one else.

If you look at my card you will find all sorts of games and completions of varying degrees but it is all for me no one else. I do not care about my gamerscore, or my completions. I have 990 in both Disney Sing It's, and Trivial Pursuit. I could finish all three for the full 1000 in less than 20 minutes, but I do not care.

As DarkTharen touched on, there are plenty of reasons why someone may not finish a game, GSL being a big one for a lot of folks. Once the GSL ends I can not be asked to play crap for any reason, especially because someone may look at my card and get ticked off that I did not finish training on Sing It, or a Tutorial on Cabela's. I have too much time missed from Gears and Rock Band for such things.

LLC2003
04-20-2009, 03:22 PM
I have a 6 year old daughter and a wife, so unfortunately the shrek and viva pinata are on there for that reason.

In response to your queries It doesnt really bother me what games people play, it bothers me when I look at a high gamerscore then click into it and look down the list and see no real sense of achievement.

If you have got seriously achievement plus some other tough achievements, I have no problem with the 'easier' type games. It's only when I see the tag littered with un-complete games and very easy 1000/1000 that I think the high-score is unfair.

Also, in regards to new games I will play at some point but probably around 6-12 months after they we're released.

Da CRU Mughhh
04-20-2009, 03:23 PM
I agree with you. Completionists get girls. Fo' Sho'.

:D

pff i wouldn't say that.

Yes a high Completion rate is nice to see, but id rather see 100k+ with what 60% completion then to see a 10k gamerscore with 100% completion!

Wreckon Dracgon
04-20-2009, 03:24 PM
I still do not see why it bothers you at all what anyone else plays.

Ohh and so my card does not anger you I have a wife and four children :drunk

But they have never played on my tag... so then again you can still be "ticked off"

Edit: Ohhh CRU... are we going to start Gears Insane soon :biglaugh

Tsaako
04-20-2009, 03:32 PM
Well, at the moment i'm trying to finish up some games as i want my Score/completion % to around 50 each. I dont let it be a big deal. Main thing i try to do is at least achieve 500+ points per retail game, they way i'm gradually getting closer to that 50% mark.

When i've accomplished that i'd be back to usual self and some point later on i'd want to work it up. Pace yourself, dont let it become a priority. If people want to play easy games for score, let them, they aint doing no harm they're let the majority of us - Gamerscore whores.

As for the tough achievements.. I have a few, but not many. I dont really care for the tough achievements, i'll give them a go at some point. But not much reason to rant because of it.

impmeister
04-20-2009, 03:34 PM
I thought Open Season was a pretty fun game actually. To be honest I don't care about completing a game to 100% anymore. Theres too many good games out there now to worry about getting all gamerscore on one game. I'd much rather play a shiny new game then spend hours/weeks/months going for a couple of achievements just to say I completed a game.

Rugger X
04-20-2009, 03:40 PM
I think its all about finding that mix that works for you. I have games on my tag that my friends brought over to play (tenchu, overlord, guitar hero) that I have almost zero points in, I'm not going to play those games myself just to get a higher completion percentage, however I will play some really easy games to boost my score in between games I just want to play for enjoyment.

Gackt
04-20-2009, 03:41 PM
pff i wouldn't say that.

Yes a high Completion rate is nice to see, but id rather see 100k+ with what 60% completion then to see a 10k gamerscore with 100% completion!

HA! Well then look no further
<---100k+ With over 65%! Completion! :D
lol

LLC2003
04-20-2009, 03:46 PM
I still do not see why it bothers you at all what anyone else plays.

Ohh and so my card does not anger you I have a wife and four children :drunk

But they have never played on my tag... so then again you can still be "ticked off"

Edit: Ohhh CRU... are we going to start Gears Insane soon :biglaugh

It doesn't really bother me in that sense, I just find it frustrating sometimes when you put in a long time to gain an achievement for a game and you look at somone with double gamerscore to you who hasn't put in the same amount of time. Got 30K+ from very easy type games.

Anyway congrats at your gamerscore mate! You definitly do not fall into the category we are talking about. It takes real dedication to reach 180K (I am amazed you get that much time to play when you have four children.:) I am constantly on the go and I only have 2)

Ideally I would love 100K+ gamerscore, with 100% completion... but who wouldn't lol

NFaMuS one
04-20-2009, 03:47 PM
I get really ticked off when I look at some peoples gamercard and it's littered with cheap games such as Naruto, Open Season and such others. This shows to me that the person who has played these games are playing them purely for the score and really gain no real sense of 'achievement' once completed.

This is not necessarily true.

I have played, Cars, Cars: Mater-National, Open Season, Avatar, among other "cheap games" as you say, and I've had a blast playing them. It makes it that much sweeter that they have easy gamerscore.

On the flip side of things, I just reached 100,000 gamerscore and I have somewhere around 59-60% completion. I'm okay with that. I have completed rather difficult games to 1000 such as Call of Duty 2, 4 and World at War.

Along with single achievements like finding 200 pigeons and getting 100% complete in GTA 4, finishing Gears of War and Gears of War 2 on Insane difficulty, also Call of Duty 4's Mile High Club achievement took me roughly 7 months to obtain (off and on playing.) Also, completing Halo 3 on legendary.

Needless to say, I'm not flaming you, I'm just making a point that it's "different strokes for different folks." :drunk

pinkpanfa
04-20-2009, 03:57 PM
When I was battling some friends for Gamerscore supremacy, it was all about Open season, The Last Airbender and tracking down a copy of College Hoops 2k6. But I enjoy gaming and I would love to complete every game I play...that just doesn't happen every time. Some games get boring, some are really annoying to get that ONE achievement (Ultimate Genesis collection with the Dr. Robotnick game and the 4 zillion orbs in Crackdown come to mind) and some achievements might not be in your best interest.

I give props to anyone that got to Elite in Rainbow Six Vegas LEGIT and for anyone that ran through Lego Star Wars:TCS at least 3 times to get the full G. Not all those kid games are like Open Season. Some make you work for the achievements. I will always respect the player that does everything in a game and gets all of the achievements but I can truly respect any player that plays Halo 3 STILL because they love the game.

I finished the original Ghosts and Goblins (before the days when you could save in game) and played Shaq Fu because I was bored. I rocked to the end of every Zelda game in existance and remember rockin Diablo from start to finish in one sitting (thank you Jolt Cola). Still haven't finished Dragon's Lair and never want to play another Silent Hill (2 made me second guess cabin vacationing more than Michael Myers).

Dedication...its all up to you. Pimp your GS or salute the writers and programmers for their hard work. You decide.

LLC2003
04-20-2009, 03:57 PM
This is not necessarily true.

I have played, Cars, Cars: Mater-National, Open Season, Avatar, among other "cheap games" as you say, and I've had a blast playing them. It makes it that much sweeter that they have easy gamerscore.

On the flip side of things, I just reached 100,000 gamerscore and I have somewhere around 59-60% completion. I'm okay with that. I have completed rather difficult games to 1000 such as Call of Duty 2, 4 and World at War.

Along with single achievements like finding 200 pigeons and getting 100% complete in GTA 4, finishing Gears of War and Gears of War 2 on Insane difficulty, also Call of Duty 4's Mile High Club achievement took me roughly 7 months to obtain (off and on playing.) Also, completing Halo 3 on legendary.

Needless to say, I'm not flaming you, I'm just making a point that it's "different strokes for different folks." :drunk

Congratulations on reaching your 100k. I think you are right, it's about finding the balance. If you like the game, you really don't mind putting the time in.

I guess me aiming for the 100% completion is more of a achievable compromise to a high score as the time I spend playing each week is limited.

The problem I am faced with now is going back to Blue Dragon and putting in 100+hours to get the 1000/1000. :(

Tunuva
04-20-2009, 04:48 PM
I agree with most of what you said in your original post, however I could be considered one of those people that annoys you too.

If I see a game that looks interesting to me, i might rent it to get a taste of it, but I don't want to feel like every game I play I am forced into getting 100% in. Generally I go by the rule that if I buy a game I should at least try to get 100% in it.

The only game I've intentionally rented for gamerscore was avatar, cause 2 mins for 1000 points was just too attractive to pass up.

Getting 100% in a game is definitely a lot more rewarding, and I also agree that the 360 achievement should display how many 1000/1000s a gamer has on their gamercard in someway. That is one thing I like about the PS3 trophy system vs the 360 achievements, Platinum trophies are basically a count of how many 100% games someone has.

Z3R0 S1X
04-20-2009, 08:05 PM
I want to add something before this gets locked later on. If you check anyone with a gamerscore of over, lets say, 50k they will have a few easy games on their card. If they've gotten over 100k they'll have more easy games on their card but quiet a few hard ones as well. If you check my card, its about half and half. Currently I'm doing Halo Wars before moving on to Mass Effect to finish out the last five achievements in it (which will take around forty or so hours). I was considering doing five or six easy 1000's to get past 40k before finishing out Mass Effect but its just for the mile stone and nothing else (I may not do it at all). As other people have stated, it depends on your reasons for playing and time constrants. Enjoy playing and make some new friends, its a hobby people not a job.

SaintKnight
04-21-2009, 02:29 AM
What also gets me frustrated is when you look at players gamercard and they have 60-70 games played and only 4 or 5 games completed! In my opinion both of these scenarios show no real skill, they simply give up when the going get's tough or don't want to spend hours collecting 200 pigeons (for example). I find this frustrating as the gamerscore system should reflect much better the players who DO put in the time to complete games fully. The Seriously achievement picture is a great example of this.


I'm the exact person you described, except it's like 80+ with 9 completions. Then again, I abuse the renting/borrowing from friend logic so that's mainly why I don't have that many completions. And, it doesn't help that I can't play Guitar Hero III on expert or Rock Band drums on expert...

Although this supports your opinion and not mine, sometimes one can get frustrated going for achievements like the Crackdown Orbs (499/500 and don't have the slightest clue where the final one is) and Lost Planet's extreme mode. Sure, I'll go and attempt them, but I don't keep going for them constantly to the point it gets stressful (ironic in my case: I am a gamer that uses games to relieve stress). And, sometimes it's impossible to get some achievements in games due to no one playing them online and/or the servers are shut down. I mean, you can boost for them, but personally I'm a believer in getting an achievement "legit" and not having to boost for it. I'll save my case on that for another time...

Anyways, my own way of achievement whoring is "get at LEAST the single player ones/as much as you can before returning the game." I may have 80+ games on my list, but by following my philosophy I have 55% and it's starting to grow as I'm replaying older games for nostalgia/achievements.

Shelton
04-21-2009, 03:35 AM
Agree with the OP to a degree. Except I don't care about people's gamerscore. I look for difficult game completions.

If I am looking to boost a time consuming achievement, I will check the other guys/girls gamercards. If they have 100K+ but no decent completions, I will be less inclined to boost with them. Purely because I do not believe they will stick around.

I focus on completion %. Others focus on boosting their score. Does it really matter though?

The achievement system is flawed.

DENAz666
04-21-2009, 03:49 AM
Screw getting 100% completion, i play games to have fun, not to get frustrated and want to throw my controller through the wall.

If i can get 100% then i'll go for it, but if it requires hours of hard work and frustration, then i just won't bother. As i said, i play to have fun

MajinDrew
04-21-2009, 04:27 AM
I can completely respect your opinion but as with any discussion based on achievements it's too each their own.

If I have a single player game where I can get a full 1000 then I will go for it but I'm not going to grind away for 200 hours on a JRPG just for the sake of 100% completion. That would suck all the joy and fun out of the game no matter how many months you spread it over.

Their are also a lot of great games out there that have MP achievements. I've had a 360 in some form or another since launch and besides the first month of free Gold Account access I got I've never played on Live. This is something I plan to rectify when I have the time and money to go Gold on my new gamertag but even then I will be doing it to meet other players and, most importantly, to have fun. I'm not a fan of MP achievements so I'm not going to take the time to get so many kills or wins, even by boosting, because once again I wouldn't get anything out of it.

If you want to talk about a sense of achievement then that is different for everyone. My greatest sense of achievement in a game came from finishing Halo 3, which isn't the hardest thing in the world, and I plan to do it again. The fact that I am doing it a second won't diminish it because I enjoyed every second of that game and I know when I take it online that will only improve but again, I'll be on there for the fun, the friends and the competition, not because I want a 100% completion rate or a high GS.

People have different priorities when it comes to achievements and for a lot of different reasons whether it be work and family commitments, money or anything else the main factor will always be what they enjoy and what they get the sense of achievement from.

People will play the games with easy GS but that's because they want to have a high GS, that's their achievement. Others will play the hell out of a game till they have 100% completions. The fact is most of us, even on this board, just want to have fun. GS and completion rate are just nice bonuses.

Andreas_loel
04-21-2009, 06:28 AM
I dont care about completion rate at all, there are some games that i cant finish at all because of different reasons so instead of trying to give a fuck i play something else.

i try to get 500+ minimum on games if possible, but some games are just way to bad or i have borrowed/sold it and they are outta the way forever seeing as i wont spend cash on rebuying them again.

mrtrick92
04-21-2009, 07:30 AM
I think that fully completing games is only neccesary when the game you are playing is a game you enjoy. I think you are forgeting many people rent games to see if they like them or not e.g. i rented army of two and hated it. I got 120 gamerscore just from playing through the first couple of levels and then put it down. Are you saying that you expect people to sit through hours of achivments on games they dont enjoy? I understand what your saying in some instances about people giving up when the going gets tough but the main reason for playing a game is for enjoyment and not achievements. So im not gunna sit down and play games i dont enjoy just to get 100% completion.

roy1751
04-21-2009, 09:22 AM
http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/08/128294552905313750onwardmybrave.jpg

...some people just take this whole achievement thing too serious!

PlugInBaby
04-21-2009, 09:37 AM
...some people just take this whole achievement thing too serious!



True, but this is a site based around achievements!:p

pinksheets
04-21-2009, 09:50 AM
Well, taking advantage of easy achievement games can only get you so far. Let's say we have a gamer with 40,000k GS, but has used just about every easy achievement game to his advantage. Let's say this gamer has a buddy who has a 24,000k GS, but has spent countless hours on the games with far more difficult achievements. If these two were to decide to have a gamerscore showdown, the latter gamer would have the advantage of all of those quick, easy points the former gamer already milked. Meanwhile, the former gamer would have already grabbed most of the low hanging fruit and have to put in some real work.

Don't feel any negative sentiment towards me, because you see King Kong or TMNT in my game history. Instead, just think to yourself, those are 2000 points you could easily have if you wanted to. On the other hand, if you pull 1000 in Blue Dragon or Table Tennis, that would be 2000 points I would have to struggle to match.

rocadepunk
04-21-2009, 11:00 AM
What also gets me frustrated is when you look at players gamercard and they have 60-70 games played and only 4 or 5 games completed! In my opinion both of these scenarios show no real skill, they simply give up when the going get's tough or don't want to spend hours collecting 200 pigeons (for example). I find this frustrating as the gamerscore system should reflect much better the players who DO put in the time to complete games fully. The Seriously achievement picture is a great example of this.


Well, I am one of your so called people who give up in this case! I have over 100 games on my card with only 5 finished. Now I used to work at Blockbuster and got free rentals, so I would try these games out and if didnt like them I wouldn't bother with them again. It's not a case of giving up. I think the statement that you make pigeon holes a lot of people. Some people don't play games just to get the full 1000 on the game. Remember achievements are relatively new to the history of gaming. I appreciate this is a website for achievement hunters, and I confess I am one, but just because I personally haven't achieved the full 1000 from every game I have played does not mean I am a worse gamer than you. I'm sorry if I sound like a dick but the way you put it sounds like you feel you a better than a lot of people just because of completion percentage.

Qavala
04-21-2009, 11:05 AM
The moral of this story: Play how you want to play and don't give a shit about anyone else :) If you want to keep a high completion rate, go for it. If the next guy wants to have a completion rate always below 35% but he's happy, then what's the problem?

LLC2003
04-21-2009, 12:30 PM
Thank you all for your feedback, as the open post stated I was merely trying to gauge people's opinions and not start a flame war.

As a closing comment I think the achievement system is great (even with it's flaws), which is something I think we can all agree on. Before the system came out we all played games once, mabye twice on differing settings. The elusive 1000 points has added longevity to a lot of games, for a lot of people. This can only be a good thing.

Achievements are also a way for us to show of our gaming skills for the world to see. People take pride in their high-gamerscore, while others take pride in the completion %.

After all that is said, gaming is meant to FUN. We all work hard day to day and many of us come to the xbox for a peaceful retreat from the stresses of every day life. Whether we play for fun, play for the score or play for the percentage, we are all doing what we do in our way!

Thanks again for all your comments and happy gaming guys!

(ps - if you want to link up and play pm me on LLC2003)

DanTheManGum
04-21-2009, 12:50 PM
Completion is way more important to me and I've always been a completionist even before achievements. Sure 100k+ is nice but doesnt show you have skill per say. Heck some people have under 1k but would mop the floor with just about anyone in Halo, Gears, or CoD4. Just mock whoever you feel like and move on with your own achievements. I still think it is cool to have that 100k+ but if someone has a decent gamerscore with some really tough games I'm more impressed. Everyone views it differently.

PureTechniquex
04-21-2009, 03:32 PM
My Completion is 66% but when i 1st bought my XBL i didnt really care about achievements & i have a few 20/1000 on the bottom of my list, if i thought about completion when i 1st started than i would have 80%+, but im willing to go back & rent those games to get it up to 80% at least. :p

DTwirler
04-21-2009, 03:39 PM
The moral of this story: Play how you want to play and don't give a shit about anyone else :) If you want to keep a high completion rate, go for it. If the next guy wants to have a completion rate always below 35% but he's happy, then what's the problem? Thank you!! Haha, well put!

xxEquilibriumxx
04-21-2009, 08:33 PM
I stopped when you said Naruto is an easy achievement game. Apparently you've never played that game. It isn't something people want to play for achievements. That and I looked at your tag and you can hardly call yourself a hardcore completionist. You have way too many unfinished games for someone with 18k

Shelton
04-21-2009, 09:53 PM
I think that fully completing games is only neccesary when the game you are playing is a game you enjoy. I think you are forgeting many people rent games to see if they like them or not e.g. i rented army of two and hated it. I got 120 gamerscore just from playing through the first couple of levels and then put it down. Are you saying that you expect people to sit through hours of achivments on games they dont enjoy? I understand what your saying in some instances about people giving up when the going gets tough but the main reason for playing a game is for enjoyment and not achievements. So im not gunna sit down and play games i dont enjoy just to get 100% completion.

People who are serious about their completion % will not play games on a whim. Research first. Even if they did rent a game, they'd play it on another tag first. Problem solved.

I own Two Worlds, which is one of the worst and most painful games to play. But I'm damn well going to finish it anyway. I may not love playing it, but I do enjoy seeing "Achievement Unlocked".
Heck some people have under 1k but would mop the floor with just about anyone in Halo, Gears, or CoD4. Definately. Its because they dedicate themselves to one game.

gatorbait
04-21-2009, 10:05 PM
Completion rate is more satisfying to achieve which is what I'm trying to improve on now. I like how it shows how many games played on the gamercard but that can be misleading since arcade games are only 200 and then some games have well over 1000 points now. They should also include completion percentages on the gamercard when people view them.

LLC2003
04-22-2009, 08:27 AM
I stopped when you said Naruto is an easy achievement game. Apparently you've never played that game. It isn't something people want to play for achievements. That and I looked at your tag and you can hardly call yourself a hardcore completionist. You have way too many unfinished games for someone with 18k

Naruto was an error, I meant to put Avatar which can be completed in under 5 mins.

As stated in my orginal post - I am a achievement 'newbie' therefore I have to re-purchase my older titles again. At the moment my gamercard doesn't look great, but if you look again in 6-12 months you will see all of the games completed.

Please read the post correctly before posting a useless reply.

J Lew332
04-22-2009, 10:55 AM
If they have 60 or 70 games played and only have 5 games completed, that doesn't mean they have no skill. Maybe they have better things to do than spend hours collecting pigeons in GTA IV. Its also better to play games because you enjoy them and not rebuy old games to get acheivements.

J Lew332
04-22-2009, 10:59 AM
And if your rebuying old games just for achievements, and not buying the new releases that r great games, isn't that kind of defeating the purpose of play video games? Im not knockin you for your liking for completing games, but your wasting time rebuying old games and ndot playing the new ones.

LLC2003
04-22-2009, 12:15 PM
And if your rebuying old games just for achievements, and not buying the new releases that r great games, isn't that kind of defeating the purpose of play video games? Im not knockin you for your liking for completing games, but your wasting time rebuying old games and ndot playing the new ones.

I can see what your saying - If there is a new game that I really want to play such as RE5, I will buy it on release date and play until completion. This logic will only apply to around 3 or 4 AAA titles a year.

I was more referring to new games on the fringe, such as Godfather II and Dead Space. They look good, and in normal circumstances I would buy, but at the moment I much prefer going back to complete the older games first.

EpicGinge
04-22-2009, 03:55 PM
pff i wouldn't say that.

Yes a high Completion rate is nice to see, but id rather see 100k+ with what 60% completion then to see a 10k gamerscore with 100% completion!
I would prefer to have the 100% at 20k and above but not 100k because I think that is just a bit to far.

duckydan
04-22-2009, 05:09 PM
I have to disagree that people play easy 1ks just for gamerscore and also that people who play hard games quit because they are too hard.

I have every easy game possible on my GC, and aside from the past two GSLs I play these games because I hate FPS. My favorite games to date have been Golden Compass, Shellshock 2, Jerischo (two FPS but fun FPS), Cars, and a few other similar games. I get more fun from these games than any COD could ever provide. Also some games that have not been completed on my list are either games that I just didn't care for (ex: 10gs in Godfather, 20gs in MuA). If I ever get really bored I may revisit them but they aren't worth my time or the effort to get those achievements. Other games such as Guitar Hero I play because I like the premise even if I suck balls at them and can barely pass Hard mode.

Also, I hate MP games. Aside from sports games I loathe MP Halo, MP Gears (aside from Horde mode), and the like. It's just not fun to me.