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MulletiaMan
11-16-2010, 08:57 PM
I'm looking to buy a new drumkit- preferably electronic for myself at Christmas, but looking online, its certainly harder then I anticipated.

Does anyone have any recommended electronic drumkits that I can get in UK via shipping? I was looking towards buying the RBP Ultimate Kit, but its America only, so that ruined that idea.

Something ideally under 400, if possible, thanks xDD

The Nerevarine
11-16-2010, 10:12 PM
If you're into drumming, I'd suggest getting a starter kit. Then you can upgrade it as you desire.

http://drums-percussion.musiciansfriend.com/electronic-drums

$400 won't get you much unless you buy used, but it will still be infinitely better than an Ion kit.

Roland > Yamaha > Alesis > Simmons

MulletiaMan
11-16-2010, 10:40 PM
If you're into drumming, I'd suggest getting a starter kit. Then you can upgrade it as you desire.

http://drums-percussion.musiciansfriend.com/electronic-drums

$400 won't get you much unless you buy used, but it will still be infinitely better than an Ion kit.

Roland > Yamaha > Alesis > Simmons

But which of these are cross-compatible with the music game genre (Rock Band/Guitar Hero) ? Because thats my main use for them, even though I am planning on taking drumming lessons too.

TwistedFate
11-16-2010, 10:51 PM
$400 won't get you much unless you buy used, but it will still be infinitely better than an Ion kit.

He's not using USD, he's using Pounds (don't know how to make the cute the little symbol), so he's talking a bit more money, but not much more than a new starter kit.

But which of these are cross-compatible with the music game genre (Rock Band/Guitar Hero) ? Because thats my main use for them, even though I am planning on taking drumming lessons too.

They pretty much all are except maybe the very lowest end Roland kit (which I don't think they make anymore). The important thing is to ensure that it has MIDI out. Most of them do so it's a not big issue, but be sure to check just in case. You will also need to get the MIDI Pro box to go with it so it can interface with the game.

The Nerevarine
11-16-2010, 11:51 PM
As long as you can edit the MIDI out settings (and it, of course, has MIDI out) it's compatible. Most of those manufacturers have the manuals on the websites to check out. It's rare that you can't remap them, and worse case scenario you buy a new brain.

Take note, though, that in Rock Band the drum charts are beyond stupid. The open hi-hat is on blue and sometimes the crash is on yellow or blue.

First problem, the blue hi-hat: I hear the Yamaha kits can map a different note to the open hi-hat, my Roland TD6 brain can not. An alternate route would be to have a second hi-hat positioned slightly above mapped to blue.

Second problem, the yellow crash: You could get used to hitting the crash and hi-hat at the same time (awkward!) or you could map your china to yellow (although this makes ending fills awkward)... your best bet, is again, a second china cymbal mapped to yellow for the YGK combo.

Third problem, well, I'm sure you've figured it out by now: a second crash that's blue. Although this one isn't as bad, since hitting the ride for a crash cymbal isn't nearly as awkward as the other two problems.

Just a warning! RB3 "Pro" drums were not designed to match what the player is playing one bit, they're simply designed to work with the shitty MadCatz cymbals and RB2 kit. The end result is either expensive work-arounds or massive fatigue and awkward movements.

Or you could play Guitar Hero with them, then it will be almost exactly what and how the drummer is playing the song, save for those few songs where they don't have the charts right like Ramblin' Man and Sweet Home Alabama. For GH, hi-hat and crash are yellow, china and ride are orange, mid/hi toms are both blue, and it works out really, really well. They even show you flams and open hi-hats by highlighting the notes, although you're not required to play them as such, you can challenge yourself to.

Also take note that I have no idea if the MIDI adapter works with GH, so you may need the GH drums to play it correctly.

TwistedFate
11-17-2010, 12:13 AM
As a counterpoint, the only problem I have is blue for open hi-hat. It was awkward on the pads, but it's just retarded on the Pro-Cymbals. I have no problems whatsoever with hitting they Yellow/Green Combo. It's pretty much the same motion as a Crash 1/China combo on my kit. Maybe it's differences in the way our kits are set up that account for the difference of opinions, but I have minimal problems with the chartings. For the songs I know on drums, they are pretty close to what I play. With the notable exception of open hi-hat.

But I do have a question for Nerevarine. Why is Yellow hat/crash good for one game and bad for the other?

EDIT: MIDI Pro adapter is RB3 only, but there are options for GH too.

The Nerevarine
11-17-2010, 02:12 AM
Maybe it's differences in the way our kits are set up that account for the difference of opinions
Probably, my cymbals: hi-hat - crash - ride - china. I keep my hi-hat relatively low and flat and my cymbals at ~45 degree angle. The cymbals are about 10" or so, with a small gap between the hi-hat and crash and about 10" between cymbals.

But I do have a question for Nerevarine. Why is Yellow hat/crash good for one game and bad for the other?

Not sure what you mean. On GH the yellow-orange-kick on my kit is crash-china-kick, which is exactly what it is supposed to be; whereas, on RB this same movement is yellow-green-kick, which means I have to hit either china-hi-hat or crash-hi-hat... since my hi-hat is flat and at a different height to my cymbals, and since I don't ever do that while drumming, it's awkward and hard to do, particularly after a fill. I usually end up hitting crash-china-kick out of habit and that's no good since it translates to green-green-kick.

I tend to use the note chart as more of a guide, looking for transitions, tom fills and crashes, and usually play the main beat and snare rolls by ear, so things like flams and multi-cymbal crashes almost always mess me up when I'm in my groove since I'll play what I'm supposed to play and RB says it's wrong.

TwistedFate
11-17-2010, 02:35 AM
Not sure what you mean. On GH the yellow-orange-kick on my kit is crash-china-kick, which is exactly what it is supposed to be; whereas, on RB this same movement is yellow-green-kick, which means I have to hit either china-hi-hat or crash-hi-hat... since my hi-hat is flat and at a different height to my cymbals, and since I don't ever do that while drumming, it's awkward and hard to do, particularly after a fill. I usually end up hitting crash-china-kick out of habit and that's no good since it translates to green-green-kick.

Okay, I think I get it. It sounds like you have Yellow and Green on the double mount on the left and Blue on the single mount on the right? That would match your real kit (sort of). That's how I set mine up at first to match as closely as possible to my real kit. I ended up moving the Green over with the Blue on the right and keeping the Yellow on the left. It's not what I'm used to, but it plays better. That would explain why the GH kit feels better to you and I don't have as big of a problem with the RB charts. I've only been playing for real for about a year and a half so changing things around may not be as big of a deal for me as it is for you if you have muscle memory of several years.

I think we're doing the exact same motions, I just have my cymbals in a different place so my natural instincts don't work against me. I'm using Blue in my Ride position and Green in my China position with nothing in my Crash position. So for me YGK is very similar to Crash 1/China/Kick. It's not optimal, but it works. I was just thinking in terms of the way my RB kit is set up, my YG is similar to the GH YO positioning. Forgot you may have yours differently and could be the same awkward motion that caused me to change mine around.

Regardless, 2 weeks till the MIDI box and I can get on my real kit and off this cramped toy. Curious to see what the "Hi-hat pedal" setting does in Pro Mode.



tl;dr: I think your RB kit is set up similar to your real kit. Mine is different from real life, but similar to GH.

The Nerevarine
11-17-2010, 03:19 AM
Yeah, I started learning on my buddy's acoustic drum kit years ago so it's a tough transition. I plan on buying an additional yellow cymbal, but I'm not sure what to do about my hi-hat problem. Maybe I need a new pedal mechanism, maybe I need a new drum brain... maybe neither of those things would work and I just need to buy a second hi-hat pad and mount it like a cowbell. Sigh, it's all ridiculously expensive... I could have bought three full Pearl acoustic kits for the same price by now.

MulletiaMan
11-17-2010, 08:12 AM
He's not using USD, he's using Pounds (don't know how to make the cute the little symbol), so he's talking a bit more money, but not much more than a new starter kit.

I don't really want anything more than a nice basic starter kit, because I definately want to step up from my basic rock band kit, and I have a friend who has been playing non-electric drums for something like seven years, and it's always been a fun little passtime learning a few basic skills with him here and there. Once i'm certain i'm able to sort this out, i'll probably spend about 1000, which if i'm correct is something closer to $2000 if the conversion is still the same.

They pretty much all are except maybe the very lowest end Roland kit (which I don't think they make anymore). The important thing is to ensure that it has MIDI out. Most of them do so it's a not big issue, but be sure to check just in case. You will also need to get the MIDI Pro box to go with it so it can interface with the game.

Okay, so if an electronic drumkit has a MIDI Out, it'll synch up and connect to a Rock Band varient of game if I buy a MIDI Pro Box? How much are they, usually?

TwistedFate
11-17-2010, 12:21 PM
Okay, so if an electronic drumkit has a MIDI Out, it'll synch up and connect to a Rock Band varient of game if I buy a MIDI Pro Box? How much are they, usually?

I don't know what they are going to cost for you, but Amazon has it listed for $30. I imagine they are going to screw you guys and just make it 30 Pounds like everything else. It doesn't come out until November 28th here, though.

MulletiaMan
11-17-2010, 01:24 PM
I don't know what they are going to cost for you, but Amazon has it listed for $30. I imagine they are going to screw you guys and just make it 30 Pounds like everything else. It doesn't come out until November 28th here, though.

Amazon does international shipping, right? Could you give me a link- I honestly don't have a clue what one of these things look like, and googling it just gives me $300 equiptment >.>

TwistedFate
11-17-2010, 01:46 PM
I tried to find it on Amazon UK, but they don't seem to have it listed. Here is the American listing.

Amazon.com: Xbox 360 Rock Band 3 MIDI PRO - Adapter: Video Games: Reviews, Prices & more

MulletiaMan
11-17-2010, 02:12 PM
I tried to find it on Amazon UK, but they don't seem to have it listed. Here is the American listing.

Amazon.com: Xbox 360 Rock Band 3 MIDI PRO - Adapter: Video Games: Reviews, Prices & more (http://www.amazon.com/Xbox-360-Rock-Band-MIDI-PRO/dp/B00409SOD2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1290000968&sr=8-1)

Thanks! It does international shipping, so i'm fine with buying that- it'll still work with UK equipment, right?

Session Pro DD506 Electronic Drum Kit Delivered From: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics

This is the kit i'm planning on getting. Look any good? I HAVE found an Alesis for about sixty pounds less, but it didn't look quite as good as this one, so.

The Nerevarine
11-17-2010, 04:19 PM
If you're going to drop that kind of cash you should really consider Roland or Yamaha... they're top-tier. That new Pearl one is probably bad-ass but I know nothing about it.

I'd also strongly suggest mesh heads - they'll give you more realistic bounce on your sticks and are super, super quiet compared to the rubber ones on the kit you linked.

The first thing I did after buying my kit was upgrade the bass drum, I bought an expensive one, but they have cheaper ones... basically my old bass was a kick trigger made of rubber similar to the one you linked to, and when I kicked it was loud and poppy, the replacement is mesh and it sounds a little boomier without being too loud.

You should also figure that most kits don't come with a kick pedal even though they display one. A decent kick pedal can range from 300-500 US depending on how many pedals you want.



Edit:

Drums:
Roland: http://www.drum-stop.co.uk/roland_td9kx_vdrums_electronic_drum_kit-p-1988.html
Yamaha: http://www.drum-stop.co.uk/yamaha_dtx_550_electronic_drum_kit-p-2065.html

...then add a kick pedal:
Single: http://www.drum-stop.co.uk/tama_iron_cobra_power_glide_single_pedal-pa-89.html
Double: http://www.drum-stop.co.uk/tama_iron_cobra_power_glide_double_pedal-pa-90.html

DW or Axis make good kick pedals too, the latter of which makes the chain-less pedals, but they get pricey and I couldn't find them on that site.

This is the kick drum I was talking about:
http://www.rolandus.com/products/productdetails.php?ProductId=723&ParentId=99

..and here's the smaller, cheaper version:
http://www.rolandus.com/products/productdetails.php?ProductId=737&ParentId=99


Edit 2:

I still don't understand how much you're trying to spend, so here's the starter versions:
http://www.drum-stop.co.uk/roland_td4k_vdrums_electronic_drum_kit-p-1985.html
http://www.drum-stop.co.uk/roland_hd1_vdrums_electronic_drum_kit-p-1983.html
http://www.drum-stop.co.uk/yamaha_dtxplorer_electronic_drums-p-33.html

The Yamaha starter kit is disappointing with zero mesh heads and weird shaped cymbals. Round cymbals that are weighted properly will give you more of a realistic response when you hit them... although nothing compares to real, metal cymbals.


And don't forget a drum throne!


And one more thing, the choke-able cymbals and dual- or tri-zone stuff is gimmick. Yeah it works to some extent, but it doesn't give you the feel of real drums that it's supposed to. The choking on my kit requires excessive force (you have to squeeze the cymbal edge) and the multiple zones aren't exactly reliable. The rim shots on the pads also don't work, you have to really crack the side of the drum with your stick and the result is massive cross-talk if it's not done 'just so' ...but maybe it would work better if the drums were individually mounted... either way, gimmicks. Nice to have but don't spend extra for them.

TwistedFate
11-17-2010, 05:56 PM
You are way out of his price range there. He's looking at 400 pounds, about $700 so he's at the bottom of the Yamaha and Roland line.

OP, I don't recommend that kit you linked mainly because I've never heard of it before. Like Nerevarine, I recommend a Roland or a Yamaha. If you absolutely must go outside of those lines, Alesis is passable, but nothing else is really worth looking at. This isn't just fan favoritism, this is from guys who have played with the kits.

Understand that in your budget range the kit you get, even going Roland or Yamaha, will not keep you happy much beyond the initial "Cool, I have drums now!!!" period. You will have to dump more money into it as your skills progress, upgrading your equipment. Mesh pads, balanced cymbals, etc...

IMHO, comparing the bottom Roland to the bottom Yamaha, the Roland wins, but they really aren't the same class anymore since Roland dropped there other entry level kit. The bottom Roland sits somewhere between the entry level Yamaha and the DTX 550 linked above.

One thing to consider, though, if money is tight, is the kick pedal. Like Nerevarine said, most do not come with a kick pedal, the Yamaha DTXplorer (that's the "entry level" starter kit with the rubber pads and funny cymbals mentioned earlier) does.

My suggestion is to shop around a bit more and make sure you understand what you are getting. Try to save more money up if you can, because in eDrums, the more you can spend at first, the happier you will be in the long run. I have the DTXplorer, because when I bought I didn't have much money, but I wanted drums. I wish I had saved a bit more and gotten at least one step up. I like my kit, but I outgrew it very quickly, and I'm probably upgrading to something similar to the Roland TD9 linked above soon.

If you have a music store near you with electronic drums set up, stop by and see if you can play around with them to see which ones you like best.

The Nerevarine
11-17-2010, 06:03 PM
ideally under 400, if possible, thanks xDD
i'll probably spend about 1000, which if i'm correct is something closer to $2000 if the conversion is still the same. ...is what has me so confused.

TwistedFate
11-17-2010, 06:09 PM
...is what has me so confused.

Oh, I missed the 1000 comment. If he's willing to go that high, by all means consider the ones you posted.

EDIT: Just checked out all your links and saw the TD4, didn't realize they had an actual entry level kit now. That's a good choice for beginners on a budget. I would have gotten that one when I bought if it was available. I had to choose between the HD1 (which I thought was discontinued) and DTXplorer in my price range.

MulletiaMan
11-17-2010, 07:10 PM
...is what has me so confused.

Oh dear, my bad. Its supposed to say for 2011's christmas, so in a year or so when I have money and have ...fine-tuned my skills, so to speak. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

But yeah, my mother is helping me out by buying one, but she said nothing over 400 because she's also helping me with some monetary issues in renovating my room. Next year i'll have more money to spend onto the drums i'm being recommended, but right now all I have is 400, give or take some leeway.

The Nerevarine
11-17-2010, 08:56 PM
Then I suggest either the entry kit like TwistedFate and a second-hand kick (lots of people sell these), or you could do what I did and go on craigslist (do they have that in the UK?) and find a second-hand kit. I bought a TD6, all mesh heads, 3 cymbals, kick pedal, and a nice drum throne, all in like-new condition for... I think I paid 1600 USD. Not sure, might have been 1200... somewhere in there, anyhow.

TwistedFate
11-17-2010, 10:36 PM
Then I suggest either the entry Yamaha kit like TwistedFate

Fixed it for you.

The DTXplorer isn't a bad kit to start with, much better than resorting to an Alesis or Simmons. Just know you are probably going to want upgrades within a year.