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ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 02:34 AM
Never mind, people are getting angry over this. I was hoping to have a discussion but some of the kids on here don't seem to know what an opinion is :) ahh well.

I never said I was going to outright boycott the game, but I was still annoyed by EA's business strategy with ME3. I was just bringing a hot topic in the gaming world to a forum I enjoy, and it still seems you can't have a discussion on any forums, even the ones you thought were decent.

Captain Urahara
02-24-2012, 02:48 AM
Not trying to cause a flame war
And yet you name your thread "Mass Effect 3 Boycott" >_>

And to answer your question, you are being too sensitive. You could just as easily say that you can't the full experience if you didn't buy another DLC such as Overlord or LOTSB, but doesn't mean it's true.
Yes it's coming out at release as Day One DLC. Does this mean it was stripped from the game? No, not exactly. Could it have been stripped? Yes.
I'm willing to bet that the Prothean doesn't even impact the game as much as everyone thinks he will.

Everyone always jumps on the bandwagon that EA is an evil company or that they are moneygrubbers. Aren't we just moneygrubbers by complaining about having to purchase something?

Shouldn't you be angry at the massive amounts of DLC for other games, like Gotham City Imposters? Over 100 pieces of DLC AT LAUNCH. Sure they can be unlocked with normal gameplay(albeit a LOT of gameplay), but they are practically begging you to take the easy way out and buy it.

Would you have preferred it if they made it so the Prothean was in the game but only unlockable if you either maxed out all multiplayer levels/characters or if you paid $10 as an easy way out?

And complaining about additional DLC from art books, figures, etc. is just stupid. All they provide is skins/boosters/etc. Little things that are nice bonuses from buying said object. Now if you had to buy the art book to be able to play as FemShep or all the figures in order to view cutscenes then that would be a different story.

Rivercurse
02-24-2012, 02:51 AM
Watched this video a couple of days ago.

I feel sorry for the guy, he's going to miss one hell of a game.

ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 02:57 AM
And yet you name your thread "Mass Effect 3 Boycott" >_>

Yeah, because it's about the Mass Effect 3 boycott...

ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 03:05 AM
And yet you name your thread "Mass Effect 3 Boycott" >_>

And to answer your question, you are being too sensitive. You could just as easily say that you can't the full experience if you didn't buy another DLC such as Overlord or LOTSB, but doesn't mean it's true.
Yes it's coming out at release as Day One DLC. Does this mean it was stripped from the game? No, not exactly. Could it have been stripped? Yes.
I'm willing to bet that the Prothean doesn't even impact the game as much as everyone thinks he will.

Everyone always jumps on the bandwagon that EA is an evil company or that they are moneygrubbers. Aren't we just moneygrubbers by complaining about having to purchase something?

Shouldn't you be angry at the massive amounts of DLC for other games, like Gotham City Imposters? Over 100 pieces of DLC AT LAUNCH. Sure they can be unlocked with normal gameplay(albeit a LOT of gameplay), but they are practically begging you to take the easy way out and buy it.

This is the arguement that alot of people are putting forward. "I bet the DLC is not even integral to the story", with me, that's not the point. The point of this is the sheer money grabbing that is going on. I don't know what you mean by "Aren't we the money grabbers", that part of your arguement makes little sense.

And for GCI, yeah, that's awful too, hence why I havn't purchased that game either. The idea to be able to purchase power in a multiplayer game is obsurd. The game turns into a "I have the more money, hence I win" rather than a "I have the most skill, hence I win".

And whooooooooa, I never said anything about having an art book or soundtrack included for CE buyers is a bad thing. Sure thats cool, give them something cosmetic or that doesn't affect the gameplay, but if you're going to dish out DLC with extra missions and gameplay, then that's not on, surely?

I never had a problem with Overlord or the Shadow Broker DLC, they were released months after the game was released which is what DLC should be. An addon to the game. But with this I just find it hard to justify the strategy to release a DLC of an interesting character which we have to pay for!

Dz06lt
02-24-2012, 03:06 AM
Nope there will be no boycott by anyone who really cares

scrummers
02-24-2012, 03:09 AM
Whatever people need to stop bitching. This day 1 shit has been going on for awhile now get over it. Either buy it or don't buy it. No one is forcing you to buy it. And who said that this DLC is a major plot point for Mass Effect 3? Does this guy have inner knowledge of Bioware we don't?

Sure it's a Prothean but I thought Mass Effect was about Commander Shepard defeating the reapers and saving the galaxy. Now I'm not defending EA I'm just saying it's not the first time this has happened and it won't be the last.

And if you all want to boycott then more power to you. But come March 6th while you are sitting there twiddling your thumbs I'll be kicking some reaper ass.

ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 03:11 AM
Lol, ok, people are getting angry. I thought it was going to be an interesting insight to how this has effected peoples opinions on the game but it's just riling people up. Feel free to lock this thread :)

Hot Juicy Pie
02-24-2012, 03:14 AM
It's just an EA tie in to get people to buy new copies of the game similar to online passes isn't it?

fastNcurious
02-24-2012, 03:14 AM
Any body else bothered by this? I'm getting pretty tired of EA's money grubbing ways, especially when it's rubbing off on some of my favourite developers.
...
Thoughts? Will this effect your purchase of the game or do you think i'm being too sensitive?

I don't think you're being too sensitive. Am I bothered by this? Yup. Will I still buy the game day one? Yup. Will I buy the DLC? Nope.

They are going to continue to nickle-and-dime because it works. Because people are buying them. I'm not, but other people are.

In a bad economy, it looks bad to raise prices so they do the next best thing. If you pay attention to groceries, ever notice how prices of some items don't change, but the amount inside each package is less or the item is smaller? Same principle. You notice you're getting less for the same amount of money, but as long as the price doesn't go up, you're not too mad. If you want to eat more, just buy another package.

They take some content out of retail game, charge the same price, so people aren't too mad. Then sell the extra stuff for a bit extra. If you want it, you buy it. They get more money. Same idea. As long as people keep buying, they will keep doing it. Same reason there will be a CoD game every year.

(Sorry, not my most articulate explanation, but you get the idea.)

Captain Urahara
02-24-2012, 03:19 AM
It's just an EA tie in to get people to buy new copies of the game similar to online passes isn't it?
No ME3 has an actual Online Pass now. ME2 had the Cerberus Network which was its version of a pass that granted free DLC for buying the game new. Guess what? People complained about it. Now we have an actual online pass and no free DLC. So all hate should be directed at those who complained about the CN.

If you complain about free stuff, then companies will start charging so they at least make something from the transaction.

Rivercurse
02-24-2012, 03:24 AM
If you've ever bought/rented a used game, then you might as well take your ire out of this thread.

EA's online pass and DLC strategy is a product of the market in which it competes.

The cold, hard, bottom line is that it still all boils down to choice in the end. Buy or don't buy.

ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 03:32 AM
If you've ever bought/rented a used game, then you might as well take your ire out of this thread.

EA's online pass and DLC strategy is a product of the market in which it competes.

The cold, hard, bottom line is that it still all boils down to choice in the end. Buy or don't buy.

Well, not entirely. I avoid buying used games because I fail to see why a games outlet should get my money and not the developers. But sometimes, when I'm unsure whether I wanna take a gamble on buying a new game, I'll rent it for a couple of nights. If I like it, cool, I'll buy it, if not then it won't ever see the inside of the Xbox again. But that's a totally different issue.

Exactly, to buy and not to buy. That's the question here.

Ethereal235
02-24-2012, 03:35 AM
Boycotting ME3 isn't going to catch on. Major fans of the series are too far in by the third game. The only thing a boycott will successfully do is deprive those participating of the experiences of the game.

If you're angry about day 1 DLC, then don't buy the DLC. Why throw out what could otherwise be a decent gaming experience for that one thing?

I guess I might be being lax about this because I was getting the CE anyways, but seriously, when did gamers start getting pissed at there being MORE content?

RDrules
02-24-2012, 04:01 AM
collectors editions should include something special its not like you need to have this character for the game, i did several runs of me2 without zaeed or kasumi
the game didnt have a massive pit where they should have been and this one wont either

PhoenixWolfCub
02-24-2012, 04:28 AM
Meh as much as it does bug me to have to spend another 10 bucks to get DLC on the release day that could have been added in, I am definitely NOT boycotting the game. lol Too damn excited for the release to not ever play it now. :P

Tai_MT
02-24-2012, 05:09 AM
So what I gather from this is...

Content that I get for free.... TWICE... You are upset at having to pay $10 for?

Lesse... I bought two LE copies of Mass Effect 3. Both on preorder. Grand total of $190 some odd dollars... Each game about $20 over the starting price...

Each game already comes with that DLC as well as some EVEN MORE AWESOME features and stuff...

And you're complaining that you'd have to spend another $10 for a completely optional character?

Dude, I already spent the $10 on that character. Why should YOU be exempt for the same content?

It costs money to produce content. You must pay voice actors. You must pay artists. You must pay writers. You must pay programmers. It all costs money. They don't work for free.

Zaeed was "Day One DLC" and I didn't see you jerkwads up in arms about HIM.

DLC is not, and never will be, integral to the core game. It's always been completely optional and up to the user to determine if it's worth it or not. If you want to extend your gameplay with more content, you purchase the content. If you don't want to, don't.

At least with the Prothean Day One DLC, there's no achievements with it like there were for Zaeed.

You people are BASICALLY bitching about having a CHOICE. If it's too expensive for DLC, don't buy it. That's your choice. You aren't being robbed of anything. They are asking that the people who made it get paid for letting you play it. That's all.

You should ACTUALLY be happy they let you HAVE the content in the first place. Some games include rare items, weapons, or missions that the full game doesn't have with their LE or CE and players who buy the standard edition copies NEVER see or play with it, and NEVER get the OPTION to pay for it. At least Bioware is saying, "why not give it to everyone who wants it? Why make it exclusive at all?"

And guess what? In exchange for it not being "exclusive", the price of the LE was about $80 instead of the $100 some games charge.

You want to boycott Mass Effect 3... Fine. I don't really care. It's your choice. If you really don't want to play it over an optional $10, that's your decision. If you don't want to pay for the DLC, then don't do that either. Wait a couple years for a "price drop" like the content in Mass Effect 1. Or, wait for the GOTY edition that has ALL the DLC for $60.

Do whatever you think is fair.

UNLESS what you think is fair is being completely childish and stupid and whiny about the whole thing. You're essentially complaining that if you want content, you have to pay for it. That if you want content other players have already paid for, you must also pay for it. Yeah, I read that right. You're upset that YOU have to pay for content that OTHER PEOPLE already paid for when they ordered their Limited Edition copies of the game. Extra content and other stuff for "hardcore fans" and it costs $20 more.

Then you come along and think, "hey, if it was already working on Day One and they're going to offer it to everyone, it should actually be free and be shipped with the game! They're money grubbing!!!"

Uh, no. Don't be stupid. The content was never free to begin with and was a "bonus" to those who decided to shell out the extra cash for the super special awesome chocolately rainbow edition of Mass Effect 3. Extra stuff in the Limited Edition or Collector's Edition has always cost extra cash. And the extra content (in game or otherwise) has always been a "bonus" to loyal players. Bioware is just unique in that they LET THE FREEBIE PLAYERS PURCHASE CONTENT THAT SHOULD BE EXCLUSIVE to the players who paid for it to begin with and got their copies of the game preordered.

Pleeb, consider yourself lucky that Bioware is even NICE ENOUGH to let you get content that SHOULD BE exclusive to those of us who actually cared enough about the series to want the Limited Edition version.

You are left with two simple choices.

Buy it. Don't buy it.

I care not which. I only care that your reasoning is severely flawed and you've decided to air it in a public forum. The only reason you'd tell US about it, IS to start a flame war. There's no other reason. Why tell the people who spend their time on the Mass Effect 3 forum? Why not tell your friends that it's stupid? Why not update your facebook status? Why tell us about it? Because we LIKE Mass Effect 3, that's why. Because we WANT the content and DON'T MIND paying the extra cash for the content.

You came here SPECIFICALLY to start a flame war.

Obvious troll is VERY obvious.

Thai J
02-24-2012, 05:23 AM
If they are just charging $10 for an unlock code for something already on the disc then this topic would have merit. A lot of people don't seem to want to care or understand that the developers finish the game at least a month before it is released due to manufacturing, certification, etc. So, they have some down time between when the game is finished and when it is released. From what I've read this DLC is aporox 600mb. Seems to me like it is very likely this is content created after the game has been completed. People just like to whine and complain. Just my opinion though.

JasonBlade
02-24-2012, 06:06 AM
A lot of ppl are over-reacting about this...seriously what's the big deal...it's just a business strategy & it works. So what if they're doing it to make money...the economy isn't the best atm & they need money to make games we love. Look at the game companies who didn't have the money & had to shut down or lay off/fire ppl. It's your choice to buy it or not buy it...either way it won't change or effect the main game.

cjdavies
02-24-2012, 06:55 AM
I read the title, not watching the video, I played 1 and 2 and want to play the third so don't really care what it's about.

Richters Shadow
02-24-2012, 08:11 AM
I think you should boycott it; idiots like you shouldn't be allowed to play something likely to be an expertly-crafted game...

H2O
02-24-2012, 08:37 AM
The point of this is the sheer money grabbing that is going on.

Games are cheap even with dlc like this.

My ME3 Collectors Edition is 60 and will give me at least 30+ hours of enjoyment. That's 2/Hour at most. More likely i'll get more than double that time out of it so it'll drop to <1/Hr.

My local squash court now costs 5.20/ hour to hire. Local Cinema 5-10 per ticket, thats a minimum of 2.50/ Hour. The list goes on...


This day one DLC was made as a bonus after the normal dev cycle was finished. Before systems like xbox live there was nothing like it as there was no way to distribute it.

Even if they were spliting content they'd be well within their rights to do it. They're not misleading anyone, they're selling their work for the price they feel it's worth and being pretty clear about what's included and what's not.


People complaining about this are just cheap losers with an overblown sense of entitlement. Just buy the game, or don't if you think it's not good value to you. Stop making out that someone's trying to cheat you though!

iBuzz7S
02-24-2012, 08:40 AM
People complaining about this are just cheap losers with an overblown sense of entitlement.
*looks over at PS3, 2 Xbox 360 consoles, 3DS and PS Vita*... nope, not cheap at all.

It's the principle. What should already be on the disc, they are releasing separately. I guarantee it, there is enough room on the disc to store this content, which would further prove what EA wanted.

13ip0lar
02-24-2012, 08:46 AM
Sad thing is I agree with a lot of things he says, especially with the idea of "buying power" as it's bullshit. However, the fact that he basically shits a brick because the day 1 DLC costs if you don't buy CE and for ME2 it was free if you bought new makes me lol. Sure it's bullshit, but it's the way it is. Fact is if he thinks his YouTube channel can convince a bunch of sheep to change their ways, he is delusional. A) He's not a chick and B) He's not that popular. Good luck with your boycott.

Burnout x360a
02-24-2012, 08:56 AM
Seeing as this is a completely separate mission that is outside the finished game it doesn't bother me. Plus it's something they decided to give non-CE buyers the option to buy if they WANT too which i'm cool with as I couldn't afford the CE.

H2O
02-24-2012, 09:07 AM
*looks over at PS3, 2 Xbox 360 consoles, 3DS and PS Vita*... nope, not cheap at all.

It's the principle. What should already be on the disc, they are releasing separately. I guarantee it, there is enough room on the disc to store this content, which would further prove what EA wanted.

Not cheap, didn't dispute being a loser though i see. :p You can be cheap and still have expensive stuff. It's about undervaluing someone's work not an unwillingness to spend money.

Ahhh, so every disc should be 100% full should it. Blu-ray games must be huge!

Disc space is irrelevant, to get this on the disc they'd of had to delay the release for a month.. and then they'd of used the disc manufacture time (another month) to develop some other day one dlc for the collectors edition that should also be on the disc.. another delay... :confused:

MintyModF1
02-24-2012, 09:22 AM
I'm not going to bother reading the rest of the thread, or watching the video....all I'm going to say, is don't judge a game that you've never played!

Burnout x360a
02-24-2012, 09:23 AM
I'm not going to bother reading the rest of the thread, or watching the video....all I'm going to say, is don't judge a game that you've never played!

Then you would be completely missing the point of what some people are judging.

iBuzz7S
02-24-2012, 09:26 AM
Not cheap, didn't dispute being a loser though i see. :p

Disc space is irrelevant, to get this on the disc they'd of had to delay the release for a month.. :( :p
They have had more than enough time to get it ready. As far as I know, the game hasn't went gold yet and the DLC, which is complete, was leaked. I think it was done on purpose to get people talking, but each to his own.

H2O
02-24-2012, 09:41 AM
They have had more than enough time to get it ready. As far as I know, the game hasn't went gold yet and the DLC, which is complete, was leaked. I think it was done on purpose to get people talking, but each to his own.

The name & price was leaked or people actually managed to download it? and when? the games been gold for a few weeks now hasn't it?

They'd have planned what bonus collectors edition dlc to make prior to going gold but that doesn't mean it was complete in time to go on the disc. It's bad enough having to wait another 2 weeks for the game, i'd of hated for them to delay it further.

either way,


Even if they were spliting content they'd be well within their rights to do it. They're not misleading anyone, they're selling their work for the price they feel it's worth and being pretty clear about what's included and what's not.



It's included in the price of my collectors edition and i feel that i'm getting good value from my 60 for the reasons i mentioned in post 22.

hydrosugar
02-24-2012, 11:42 AM
Even if I cared(I don't), I'm not stubborn enough to miss out on a game of this magnitude for my beliefs.

Burnout x360a
02-24-2012, 11:58 AM
They have had more than enough time to get it ready. As far as I know, the game hasn't went gold yet and the DLC, which is complete, was leaked. I think it was done on purpose to get people talking, but each to his own.

Actually it went gold last week.

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/335574/mass-effect-3-goes-gold/

ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 12:13 PM
Wow, so far people have been calling each other cheap, trolls, idiots and even "jerkwads" (whatever that is?). What a lovely forum this is :) It's a shame that the internet can't have a discussion.

H2O
02-24-2012, 12:43 PM
Wow, so far people have been calling each other cheap, trolls, idiots and even "jerkwads" (whatever that is?). What a lovely forum this is

It's hard to have a discussion with someone when their starting point is to completely disregard the facts of the situation. ;)

It's a shame that the internet can't have a discussion.

Also the internet is no Geth. It's not an AI and is therefore incapable of discussing anything. I agree it'd be pretty cool if it could though. :p

Tai_MT
02-24-2012, 02:01 PM
Wow, so far people have been calling each other cheap, trolls, idiots and even "jerkwads" (whatever that is?). What a lovely forum this is :) It's a shame that the internet can't have a discussion.

Yeah, pretty hard to have a "discussion" when the one starting the topic isn't in full possession of not just the facts, but their faculties. You know, things like logic and common sense...

We did actually have a discussion though. Since you didn't read it, I'll summarize...

Most people are saying, "so what?" to the $10 purchase and saying, "why is this a debate? Either buy it or don't, decide for yourself whether it's worth it or not." And they're finally saying, "It's not integral to the plot in any way nor does it have achievements so why boycott it over that?"

Now since you've decided to simply avoid the subject you started and comment entirely on what people have called each other... While also complaining that there's no "discussion"...

You're leading me to believe EVEN MORE that you did post it just to troll and don't care about any of the intelligent discussion brought up.

Thanks for trying though. It's been fun!

Grifter Reborn
02-24-2012, 02:25 PM
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_tOJ0BeW5vXw/TPMTu5Ih5KI/AAAAAAAAAAM/DJp86ZUDrfg/s1600/Butthurt.PNG

Frazerz1990
02-24-2012, 02:39 PM
I won't be buying it, but not because of any other reason except for these
- I haven't played 1 or 2, and feel it's too much to ask myself to play through them especially being an RPG game.
- I cannot really afford to be buying all 3 even if I wanted to start
- The only games I plan on spending my money on this year is Borderlands 2 in September and GTA 5 if it is released this year, if not then next.

I watched 5 minutes of Mass Effect 3 and the quality looks really decent, still isn't my cuppa tea though.
And with the whole DLC boycott nonsense, how is this any different than when L.A Noire released the game with 4 DLC that was availble on release date so long as you bought the game from 4 different retail shops? AND they included achievements too. People just need to grow up and make up their own minds instead of being sheep following the crowds.

RABLE RABLE RABLE DEY TUK URHH JURBS

Kaiyo
02-24-2012, 03:26 PM
Wait there's no achievements in the Prothean DLC.. pure bs...

Itachi 117
02-24-2012, 03:34 PM
the thing people seem to be ignoring is that from the beginning this DLC was part of the Collectors edition. the collectors edition which is an extra $20. People complained so Bioware made it so others could purchase the DLC, now thats not enough for some people. they just want it to be free. I say if they made it free the CE should be $10 cheaper because they are removing content for the people out there who didnt plan ahead and are now comploaining about it.

ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 03:58 PM
Yeah, pretty hard to have a "discussion" when the one starting the topic isn't in full possession of not just the facts, but their faculties. You know, things like logic and common sense...

We did actually have a discussion though. Since you didn't read it, I'll summarize...

Most people are saying, "so what?" to the $10 purchase and saying, "why is this a debate? Either buy it or don't, decide for yourself whether it's worth it or not." And they're finally saying, "It's not integral to the plot in any way nor does it have achievements so why boycott it over that?"

Now since you've decided to simply avoid the subject you started and comment entirely on what people have called each other... While also complaining that there's no "discussion"...

You're leading me to believe EVEN MORE that you did post it just to troll and don't care about any of the intelligent discussion brought up.

Thanks for trying though. It's been fun!

Lol, I love how I'm the bad guy just for bringing this information to this forum. I stated why I agree with the guy in the video and why I'm annoyed at the strategy, I won't state those reasons again because i'll be accused of "trolling", "having no common sense or logic" or "YOU HAZ NO MONEHS HAW HAW HAW".

If you were a rational human being and wanted to put anything forward in this thread, then you would have watched the video and stated your claim against it, instead you just called me a troll and vanished.

The reason why people are annoyed or "butthurt" as some people call it, is that this business practice of "oh, the game has gone into certification, let's make a very interesting looking DLC (a PROTHEAN SQUADMATE!) and sell it Day 1, adding a further 10 to the price". People are weary, as so they should be, that developers and publishers are getting further and further into the realms of trying to squeeze as much money out of the consumer as possible, and people don't want to stand for it.

Thanks for trying to add to the discussion though. :)

ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 04:12 PM
This ^^



and this...^^^



And most importantly this ^^^^^^^^^

The EA online pass thing has been getting debated, rationalized, and cursed at since the day they even announced they were thinking about it.

Minty and several other Mods on this site have explained it to the satisfaction of rational human beings time and time again.

Cool, only this has nothing to with the online passes. I agree with online passes as they deter the sale of second hand sales...

And what facts did I not have exactly?

RDrules
02-24-2012, 04:15 PM
Wait there's no achievements in the Prothean DLC.. pure bs...

I dont recall anything being confirmed either way tbh

but Zaeed had an achievement attached and both dragon ages characters have had achievements attached so it wouldnt surprise me if it did have one or two

XxStuartxX 1990
02-24-2012, 05:10 PM
Honestly I agree, with this day 1 DLC, sure I'm usually against it but............ This one is a way to reward those who invest in the collectors edition, without punishing those who get the regular edition.

Its kinda like what they did with the exile prince DLC for DA:2.

Snoop QC
02-24-2012, 05:13 PM
And if you all want to boycott then more power to you. But come March 6th while you are sitting there twiddling your thumbs I'll be kicking some reaper ass.

Yeah baby!!! If the add on is good and adds something to the story I won't mind having paid for it (well I bought the CE so technically it doesn't apply but anyway...).

Burnout x360a
02-24-2012, 05:25 PM
sell it Day 1, adding a further 10 to the price

10? I thought it was 800 microsoft points.

fastNcurious
02-24-2012, 05:50 PM
You're leading me to believe EVEN MORE that you did post it just to troll and don't care about any of the intelligent discussion brought up.

I honestly don't think he's trolling. As soon as he realized the tone of people's comments, he even asked for the thread to be locked up (see post #8).

At this point, I think he's just in defense mode; we should give him a break. I don't see anything wrong with someone expressing his opinion that he'd like to boycott a game because of the way DLC is being handled.

(Also apologies if OP is a she; I didn't feel like typing "s/he" repeatedly.)

Hot Juicy Pie
02-24-2012, 06:13 PM
Personally I don't see what the big deal is. It's been known for some time that this DLC was included in the collectors edition. Would you people getting normal edition rather not have the option of getting it at all?

Vindicator51
02-24-2012, 06:22 PM
At this point there's not much to do against EA(ware). I just hope that enough people don't shell out for the missing pa..i mean DLC content.

Play the normal game, but boycott the (obviously not important) content.

Burnout x360a
02-24-2012, 06:28 PM
Personally I don't see what the big deal is. It's been known for some time that this DLC was included in the collectors edition. Would you people getting normal edition rather not have the option of getting it at all?

No way, I couldn't afford the CE but being able to get this somewhere down the line is nice.

Tai_MT
02-24-2012, 06:39 PM
I honestly don't think he's trolling. As soon as he realized the tone of people's comments, he even asked for the thread to be locked up (see post #8).

At this point, I think he's just in defense mode; we should give him a break. I don't see anything wrong with someone expressing his opinion that he'd like to boycott a game because of the way DLC is being handled.

(Also apologies if OP is a she; I didn't feel like typing "s/he" repeatedly.)

I have no problem with the boycott, nor have I ever had a problem with that. If you don't want to buy it, that's fine. But using the excuse of "they haz bad biznezz pwactice cuz of dey won DLC!!!" is rather silly AND stupid. The "extra character" and "extra mission" were announced with the LE WHEN THEY ANNOUNCED the LE. So that Prothean and mission have been around SINCE THEN. Perhaps even BEFORE. And his entire complaint is, "why should I have to pay for it?". Well, I'm sorry, but those of us who bought the LE paid for it. Why should OTHER PEOPLE who DIDN'T preorder get it for free? When I saw it, I considered it "exclusive content" like other games typically do with more characters, missions, items, etcetera to do. Then about a week ago, we find out that OTHER PEOPLE will have access to it as well, if they choose to pay $10 for it.

The entire argument against this particular Day One DLC is based around an idea that they're ENTITLED to something... When that something was probably originally only going to be given to LE purchasers. Zaeed was Day 1 DLC, but you got him for free if you bought the game new and put in the code for the Cerberus Network. If you bought the game used, you had to buy the Cerberus Network to get him. He wasn't "Limited Edition" content, but some of the "Limited Edition" content WAS later released for other players in the form of an "equipment pack" which costed about 800 points or so as well.

If the DLC was relatively "vital" and not just something "for fun" or "to extend gameplay", I could see being up in arms about it and using it as an excuse to boycott the game. I really could. In such an instance, I'd likely jump on the bandwagon.

But Mass Effect DLC has ALWAYS been "for fun" or "optional". It's there if you want to have more gameplay and nothing more. It's not like other games that release stupid little "bonus" packs that don't really add to the game at all. Most of the stuff you get is relatively useful or pretty fun. I personally enjoyed Bring Down The Sky, Project Overlord, and Lair of the Shadowbroker. I also enjoyed Zaeed's and Kasumi's personal quests. Do I use those DLC characters? No. But, I enjoy having them and doing their quests each time I run through the game.

Now, to boycott a game over an optional piece of content with no repurcussions (indeed, I doubt it'll carry through to the next Mass Effect, seeing as how this is the LAST ONE in Shepard's story) for not playing it... It's stupid. Want to boycott the game over the stupid Onlilne Pass, good deal. I hate that crap too. I always buy new, but I still think it's crap. Want to boycott it because they added in Multiplayer in a strictly singleplayer experience. Awesome. Boycott the game for something that you have no choice or control over. But boycotting over an OPTIONAL piece of material that you ARE NOT required to pay for UNLESS YOU WANT TO... Well, that's pretty freakin' dumb.

I don't care who you are, it's pretty dumb. I don't care if you're God himself. I'd still call you stupid.

If his topic had been about boycotting it for ANY other reason than the one he chose... I'd be right there with him. I really would. I'd say "More power to you!" and "Hoorah!". I've often told other people that if they don't want a game I want, then that's fine. Not everyone has to like what I like. People can even have outright severe reactions to games I enjoy... I will point out what is silly or stupid about their arguments (if they have silly and/or stupid arguments to support their opinion), but they are entitled to have them.

Want to boycott Mass Effect 3? Go for it. But when you tell me it's over "Day One DLC" that is "completely optional", I'm going to scratch my head and go, "that sounds pretty retarded". And I'm sorry, but I can't tolerate stupidity well. I have a severe allergic reaction to it and must put the offenders in their place.

As for calling him a troll... I'm sorry, I can't imagine anyone starting such a topic with such arguments WITHOUT WANTING to troll. I really can't.

Hoborg
02-24-2012, 06:51 PM
I won't be buying it, but not because of any other reason except for these
- I haven't played 1 or 2, and feel it's too much to ask myself to play through them especially being an RPG game.
- I cannot really afford to be buying all 3 even if I wanted to start
- The only games I plan on spending my money on this year is Borderlands 2 in September and GTA 5 if it is released this year, if not then next.

I watched 5 minutes of Mass Effect 3 and the quality looks really decent, still isn't my cuppa tea though.
And with the whole DLC boycott nonsense, how is this any different than when L.A Noire released the game with 4 DLC that was availble on release date so long as you bought the game from 4 different retail shops? AND they included achievements too. People just need to grow up and make up their own minds instead of being sheep following the crowds.

RABLE RABLE RABLE DEY TUK URHH JURBS

So you're only buying 1 or possibly 2 games this year? I am sorry man but that sounds like you're either incredibly casual/disinterested or just plain cheap.

I don't understand people with that mentality. I hate to say this but if you really love video games and you can't afford Mass Effect, why don't you get a better job?

ash356
02-24-2012, 06:52 PM
I disagree with it. Thus I won't be buying the DLC. Not day-1 anyway (Explanation a little below)
I'm not going to boycott the whole game though, just that particular DLC.
Hell, my xbox live gold runs out some point in april anyhow, so I'll just get the '12 month + 800 points' card deal thats still floating around, and get it with those points if i'm so inclined.
Also, don't get all the hate towards the OP. S/He's just expressing his opinion, that doesn't make him a 'troll', 'idiot' or 'cheap.' You all just seem to be over-reacting over the issue. If they'd directly posed 'Thizzzz gaems crup dun get it or ure a looserrrr' then I could understand, but it seemed to be politely worded and liberal, something which I can safely say some of these comments aren't.
Also, people arguing that 'It's the fault of all the people who complained about the content of the Cerberus pass'.
No, it isn't. To my knowledge, no-one complained about the Bad Company 2 variant of the online pass, yet DICE still felt the need to abandon this incentive-based approach. Oh, and who publishes BF? Oh yeah, EA.
Even if were that reason, how is that logical? That's like saying this:
Person accidentally gets shot in the foot. Person complains about getting shot. Person gets shot in the head in reaction. Court finds shooter innocent because the person 'shouldn't have complained.'
Yes, it's a little unrelated to ME3, but it's the same rough idea as the aforementioned thesis of the complainers of the CP. How does complaining about an issue, in good business, facilitate and lead to an even worse result?
Edit: P.S. Just like to add, however, that this isn't nearly as bad as Gears 3's weapon skins BS.

13ip0lar
02-24-2012, 07:18 PM
I'm not going to bother reading the rest of the thread, or watching the video....all I'm going to say, is don't judge a game that you've never played!

Then you would be completely missing the point of what some people are judging.

I won't be buying it, but not because of any other reason except for these
- I haven't played 1 or 2, and feel it's too much to ask myself to play through them especially being an RPG game.
- I cannot really afford to be buying all 3 even if I wanted to start
- The only games I plan on spending my money on this year is Borderlands 2 in September and GTA 5 if it is released this year, if not then next.

I watched 5 minutes of Mass Effect 3 and the quality looks really decent, still isn't my cuppa tea though.
And with the whole DLC boycott nonsense, how is this any different than when L.A Noire released the game with 4 DLC that was availble on release date so long as you bought the game from 4 different retail shops? AND they included achievements too. People just need to grow up and make up their own minds instead of being sheep following the crowds.

RABLE RABLE RABLE DEY TUK URHH JURBS
I really hate people. This isn't directed at anyone in specific just the stupidity that occurs when you talk to a mob of people as opposed to a person. All I wanna say is, to the guy going on about LA Noire and bitching, correct me if I'm wrong but only a couple of weeks after launch they had a season pass where you got all the DLC for 800 points. So the only people that got hosed were tards that spent their time buying 4 copies and trying to scam retailers out of the DLC without purchasing the game.

ZuBzErO123
02-24-2012, 07:43 PM
I have no problem with the boycott, nor have I ever had a problem with that. If you don't want to buy it, that's fine. But using the excuse of "they haz bad biznezz pwactice cuz of dey won DLC!!!" is rather silly AND stupid. The "extra character" and "extra mission" were announced with the LE WHEN THEY ANNOUNCED the LE. So that Prothean and mission have been around SINCE THEN. Perhaps even BEFORE. And his entire complaint is, "why should I have to pay for it?". Well, I'm sorry, but those of us who bought the LE paid for it. Why should OTHER PEOPLE who DIDN'T preorder get it for free? When I saw it, I considered it "exclusive content" like other games typically do with more characters, missions, items, etcetera to do. Then about a week ago, we find out that OTHER PEOPLE will have access to it as well, if they choose to pay $10 for it.

The entire argument against this particular Day One DLC is based around an idea that they're ENTITLED to something... When that something was probably originally only going to be given to LE purchasers. Zaeed was Day 1 DLC, but you got him for free if you bought the game new and put in the code for the Cerberus Network. If you bought the game used, you had to buy the Cerberus Network to get him. He wasn't "Limited Edition" content, but some of the "Limited Edition" content WAS later released for other players in the form of an "equipment pack" which costed about 800 points or so as well.

If the DLC was relatively "vital" and not just something "for fun" or "to extend gameplay", I could see being up in arms about it and using it as an excuse to boycott the game. I really could. In such an instance, I'd likely jump on the bandwagon.

But Mass Effect DLC has ALWAYS been "for fun" or "optional". It's there if you want to have more gameplay and nothing more. It's not like other games that release stupid little "bonus" packs that don't really add to the game at all. Most of the stuff you get is relatively useful or pretty fun. I personally enjoyed Bring Down The Sky, Project Overlord, and Lair of the Shadowbroker. I also enjoyed Zaeed's and Kasumi's personal quests. Do I use those DLC characters? No. But, I enjoy having them and doing their quests each time I run through the game.

Now, to boycott a game over an optional piece of content with no repurcussions (indeed, I doubt it'll carry through to the next Mass Effect, seeing as how this is the LAST ONE in Shepard's story) for not playing it... It's stupid. Want to boycott the game over the stupid Onlilne Pass, good deal. I hate that crap too. I always buy new, but I still think it's crap. Want to boycott it because they added in Multiplayer in a strictly singleplayer experience. Awesome. Boycott the game for something that you have no choice or control over. But boycotting over an OPTIONAL piece of material that you ARE NOT required to pay for UNLESS YOU WANT TO... Well, that's pretty freakin' dumb.

I don't care who you are, it's pretty dumb. I don't care if you're God himself. I'd still call you stupid.

If his topic had been about boycotting it for ANY other reason than the one he chose... I'd be right there with him. I really would. I'd say "More power to you!" and "Hoorah!". I've often told other people that if they don't want a game I want, then that's fine. Not everyone has to like what I like. People can even have outright severe reactions to games I enjoy... I will point out what is silly or stupid about their arguments (if they have silly and/or stupid arguments to support their opinion), but they are entitled to have them.

Want to boycott Mass Effect 3? Go for it. But when you tell me it's over "Day One DLC" that is "completely optional", I'm going to scratch my head and go, "that sounds pretty retarded". And I'm sorry, but I can't tolerate stupidity well. I have a severe allergic reaction to it and must put the offenders in their place.

As for calling him a troll... I'm sorry, I can't imagine anyone starting such a topic with such arguments WITHOUT WANTING to troll. I really can't.

Wow, big speech. This will be my last post replying to you as I now think you're doing this on purpose to be the "troll".

People are annoyed by this, for reasons I have already expressed and for reasons that are clearly detailed in the video (if you actually took the time out to watch it but as you still seem to not understand why people are angry, then I'm really starting to question your logic, fanboy maybe? I don't know.)

With the amount of views, comments and "likes" (god I hate those terms lol), it seems to have had a negative effect one many other people too. Now, I never said I was going to outright boycott the game, I'm a huge fan of Mass Effect and I want to see the story to the end, but I WILL be boycotting the DLC, for reasons I have stated.

After doing a lot of research and thinking (hence I see no reason why people are saying I havn't looked at the facts. What facts exactly?) I decided to come to my favourite forum to see what other like minded gamers thought about it, only to be greeted by hostility, namely being called the usual internet slang of "troll" and me being "butthurt" *sigh*

I then asked for the thread to be locked because it obviously was turning into a heated pile of gibberish. I merely wanted to see what other people thought about it and I feel sorry for you for thinking I was "trolling", that probably says more about your interpretation of the internet rather than my post.

But anyways, I don't agree with the practice, some people don't mind it seems, that's fine, it's not the end of the world. Let's just kick the reaper's arse come March :)

xXmyxxmastaXx
02-25-2012, 02:54 AM
http://stliq.com/gtnew/bg/j/john-riccitiello.jpg

^^ john ricitello pres of EA. leader of the E(A)mpire

Auburok
02-25-2012, 04:36 AM
Honestly I agree, with this day 1 DLC, sure I'm usually against it but............ This one is a way to reward those who invest in the collectors edition, without punishing those who get the regular edition.

Its kinda like what they did with the exile prince DLC for DA:2.

No, not the same. Signature Edition of Dragon Age 2 was a free upgrade if you preorded before Jan 11 2011, which wasn't really a "limited" run. This DLC is "free" if you buy the CE, which is limited.

Frazerz1990
02-25-2012, 04:37 AM
I really hate people. This isn't directed at anyone in specific just the stupidity that occurs when you talk to a mob of people as opposed to a person. All I wanna say is, to the guy going on about LA Noire and bitching, correct me if I'm wrong but only a couple of weeks after launch they had a season pass where you got all the DLC for 800 points. So the only people that got hosed were tards that spent their time buying 4 copies and trying to scam retailers out of the DLC without purchasing the game.
I wasn't bitching about L.A Noire, I simply stated how is it any different to use as an example, given that most of the so called boycotting is about day 1 content. And yes, you're right they did have a season pass. :)

So you're only buying 1 or possibly 2 games this year? I am sorry man but that sounds like you're either incredibly casual/disinterested or just plain cheap.

I don't understand people with that mentality. I hate to say this but if you really love video games and you can't afford Mass Effect, why don't you get a better job?

Well, I suppose you're right. I haven't really seen many games that have interested me apart from Borderlands 2 & GTA 5, it's early days into the year really so if I see anything that does interest me I will be buying it. I've only just started working on my overall % completion aswell, so I'm going over my older games until I'm a bit more satisfied that I've given it a decent shot.

And another reason is that I'm going to Sweden for 5 months in September, so I won't be able to play my xbox anyway. *shrug*

mjc0961
02-25-2012, 05:34 AM
If you don't like day one DLC, it's not enough to boycott just one game. You have to boycott all games from EA, and all games from any other publisher that does it too. And that means every game they make and/or publish.

Also, http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/3857-BOYCOTT

And besides, if I'm going to get pissed at anyone over this, I'm going to get pissed at all the retards who bitched about Project Ten Dollar. You remember that, right? Free DLC if you buy the game new? It was a great deal. But no, for some stupid fucking reason, people had to bitch about it. So now all we get if we buy the game new is a lousy online pass, when two years ago we would have got this DLC for free. Thanks guys, this is so much better than Project Ten Dollar.

No ME3 has an actual Online Pass now. ME2 had the Cerberus Network which was its version of a pass that granted free DLC for buying the game new. Guess what? People complained about it. Now we have an actual online pass and no free DLC. So all hate should be directed at those who complained about the CN.

If you complain about free stuff, then companies will start charging so they at least make something from the transaction.
http://www.wealthinnetworking.org/files/large_Internet%20High%20Five.png

13ip0lar
02-25-2012, 05:58 AM
I wasn't bitching about L.A Noire, I simply stated how is it any different to use as an example, given that most of the so called boycotting is about day 1 content. And yes, you're right they did have a season pass. :)

My bad, came across that way to me. However, there were than a few people bitching about it and bragging about how they scammed retailers out of preorder DLC, on these forums nonetheless.

If you don't like day one DLC, it's not enough to boycott just one game. You have to boycott all games from EA, and all games from any other publisher that does it too. And that means every game they make and/or publish.

Also, http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/3857-BOYCOTT

And besides, if I'm going to get pissed at anyone over this, I'm going to get pissed at all the retards who bitched about Project Ten Dollar. You remember that, right? Free DLC if you buy the game new? It was a great deal. But no, for some stupid fucking reason, people had to bitch about it. So now all we get if we buy the game new is a lousy online pass, when two years ago we would have got this DLC for free. Thanks guys, this is so much better than Project Ten Dollar.


http://www.wealthinnetworking.org/files/large_Internet%20High%20Five.png

This made me lol^. This is why I hate people, but not individuals. Confused? :D

Yaymez
02-25-2012, 11:33 AM
I think in some abstract way, some people feel that they are somehow entitled to it. Alot of people are screaming and waving their arms angrily to all who will listen "DLC I have to pay for? THIS WILL END THE GAMING INDUSTRY!!! Why should I have to pay for anything extra?! I don't deserve this treatement!".

No, this self entitled and heavily opinionated view on how the gaming industry -works- as a business will be responsible.

Everyone has strong views on this, but I think the majority of people that are complaining are the ones that can't or won't really come to terms with the fact that the gaming industry doesn't exist solely to provide them with pleasure. That is definitely a part of it, but what needs to be grasped and understood here is that it is a business. By definition it needs to make money. If it doesn't make money then you have no more gaming industry. Does this make sense? I sometimes feel like i'm taking crazy pills when I read posts on this type of thing.

http://26.media.tumblr.com/zk2Z35IWTfpbdq6hLeEW0PMPo1_500.jpg


It feels like people are only just now realising that the way gaming and content is distributed has changed. I've seen some hilarious whining with lines like 'I wish the internet didn't exist, then at least i'd get the full game'. Yes, you would get the full game, but it would still be on a clunky low bit cartridge complete with bugs -that will never be fixed- because there is no internet to patch them. People somehow operate through rose-tinted goggles here and forget that just because the full game arrived on a plastic brick, it was bug free and perfect.

You complain about this, then buy the content. Then you go away. Then when another game comes along with a similar set up, you complain about it, then buy the content and go away again. Good job guys, really, well done.

XxStuartxX 1990
02-25-2012, 02:04 PM
No, not the same. Signature Edition of Dragon Age 2 was a free upgrade if you preorded before Jan 11 2011, which wasn't really a "limited" run. This DLC is "free" if you buy the CE, which is limited.

I know its not exactly the same, thats why I said 'kinda', I just feel as if it follows the same principle.

ZuBzErO123
02-25-2012, 02:23 PM
I think in some abstract way, some people feel that they are somehow entitled to it. Alot of people are screaming and waving their arms angrily to all who will listen "DLC I have to pay for? THIS WILL END THE GAMING INDUSTRY!!! Why should I have to pay for anything extra?! I don't deserve this treatement!".

No, this self entitled and heavily opinionated view on how the gaming industry -works- as a business will be responsible.

Everyone has strong views on this, but I think the majority of people that are complaining are the ones that can't or won't really come to terms with the fact that the gaming industry doesn't exist solely to provide them with pleasure. That is definitely a part of it, but what needs to be grasped and understood here is that it is a business. By definition it needs to make money. If it doesn't make money then you have no more gaming industry. Does this make sense? I sometimes feel like i'm taking crazy pills when I read posts on this type of thing.

http://26.media.tumblr.com/zk2Z35IWTfpbdq6hLeEW0PMPo1_500.jpg


It feels like people are only just now realising that the way gaming and content is distributed has changed. I've seen some hilarious whining with lines like 'I wish the internet didn't exist, then at least i'd get the full game'. Yes, you would get the full game, but it would still be on a clunky low bit cartridge complete with bugs -that will never be fixed- because there is no internet to patch them. People somehow operate through rose-tinted goggles here and forget that just because the full game arrived on a plastic brick, it was bug free and perfect.

You complain about this, then buy the content. Then you go away. Then when another game comes along with a similar set up, you complain about it, then buy the content and go away again. Good job guys, really, well done.

To be honest, that's bullshit. Mass Effect 1 sold 3+ million copies, Mass Effect 2 sold 5+ million copies, ME3 will probably sell even more. Money isn't an issue for EA, they don't NEED to do day 1 DLC, it's not a necessity or otherwise they will go under. In my opinion, it's just getting into the realms of greed, and I would bet that Bioware didn't have a say in the matter.

Do you know how much money Fifa and Madden make alone on Ultimate Team packs, thousands of people every day use the microtransaction method of buying packs with their MSP and it all adds up. And with a development time of 1 year between each game, the amount of cash they must be making must be incredible.

There are other ways to make money, as we've seen by smaller developers and even indie developers, such as letting people buy the alpha build for a very cheap price or by simply making a good enough game that people will not want to put down. Mass Effect 3 will have done fine without this, they could have easily given it for free to everyone, but it's just extra money for the end of year christmas party for EA.

But to be honest, I can't really blame them. I understand why online passes came about, some people don't seem to get that this thread was never about online passes, but was about the day 1 DLC. They have found a niche that people will fall for, and I can't really blame them.

WipeoutBoy1
02-25-2012, 02:45 PM
You should only boycott it is if its already on the disc, 800msp for a key fuck no. But to me its the cheap people complaining cause they want all the extras available in the standard version for nothing.

kdogground2
02-25-2012, 02:51 PM
http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/17eig06xukt8apng/original.png

Not sure if this has been posted here yet but yeah.

The most annoying part of this is that the DLC was made for the CE as a bonus. But since they knew not everyone who wanted one and that people who didn't want to pay for the CE would want it they decided to release it stand alone for relitivly cheap. (people who got the CE payed $20 more for the game (Or more depending on region. UK Game being 40 and 70 for CE. With rates of 1 = $1.5 more or less thats what? an extra $45 for the CE? and worse in other countrys) While the people complaining get it for the low low price of $10.)

But because it was ready for launch they should get it for free?

grimkillah
02-25-2012, 03:47 PM
What I found amusing is that BioWare has been doing this for years, and yet everyone acts like it just happened today.

2009 - Dragon Age: Origins - Warden's Keep
Free for Digital Collector's Edition, 560MSP for everyone else.

2010 - Mass Effect 2 - Zaeed
Free for every new purchase, 1/5 of 1200MSP for everyone else.

2011 - Dragon Age 2 - The Exiled Prince
Free for Signature Edition, 560MSP for everyone else.

2012 - Mass Effect 3 - From Ashes
Free for N7 Edition, 800MSP for everyone else.

ash356
02-25-2012, 04:28 PM
Do you know how much money Fifa and Madden make alone on Ultimate Team packs, thousands of people every day use the microtransaction method of buying packs with their MSP and it all adds up. And with a development time of 1 year between each game, the amount of cash they must be making must be incredible.



I couldn't say for sure how much they make altogether, but I know that at least one of my friends has spent at least 100 on ultimate team packs for Fifa 12.
100! For something that will be completely irrelevant by the time Fifa 13 comes out anyway :S
EA must make an absolute killing off people like him...

Vindicator51
02-25-2012, 04:37 PM
What I found amusing is that BioWare has been doing this for years, and yet everyone acts like it just happened today.

2009 - Dragon Age: Origins - Warden's Keep
Free for Digital Collector's Edition, 560MSP for everyone else.

2010 - Mass Effect 2 - Zaeed
Free for every new purchase, 1/5 of 1200MSP for everyone else.

2011 - Dragon Age 2 - The Exiled Prince
Free for Signature Edition, 560MSP for everyone else.

2012 - Mass Effect 3 - From Ashes
Free for N7 Edition, 800MSP for everyone else.

I think the difference here is that it may, or may not be important story from this character. Those you mentioned people didn't really care about.

mjc0961
02-25-2012, 06:08 PM
This made me lol^. This is why I hate people, but not individuals. Confused? :DNope.

Men in Black - People - YouTube

http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/17eig06xukt8apng/original.png

The part I disagree with there is "Multiplayer replaced the need for Project 10 Dollar". No it didn't. It just let EA give new game buyers nothing while pretending they gave them something. Project 10 Dollar says "Thanks for buying our game new, here's some extra content to show our appreciation". Online Pass says "Fuck you bitch! You haven't proven that you bought this game new yet! Enter the code or give us $10 you filthy used game buying swine!"
Plus I don't ever recall anyone asking for a shitty horde mode knock-off to be added to this game in the first place.

And let's be clear, I perfectly understand how game development works and why this day one DLC exists. I'm not upset about that or joining the "boycott". I just think it's shitty that two years ago, we got bonus content for free as thanks for buying the game, and this time around, they put in a tacked on boring horde mode so they could "generously" give us an online pass instead.

drakes_guardian
02-25-2012, 06:18 PM
Honestly I think this is a good idea the Mass Efeect collectors edition has been sold out for a while in most places. Sort of fixes the problem of not missing out because you weren't quick enough to preorder or played the demo of something and decided you love it. My friend had never played Mass Effect til the demo and is now playing through 1 and 2 in preparation should he miss out on the character because he's a late adapter, seems silly to me.

fastNcurious
02-25-2012, 06:27 PM
http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/17eig06xukt8apng/original.png


First of all, whoever made this graphic has too much free time on their hands.

Second, despite the middle part being overly exaggerated for effect, I think it's insulting and probably applies to your general, prepubescent and/or casual gamer. Most serious gamers know that's not how the schedule goes.

Third, basic psychology: emotions always trumps logic. No amount of charts, graphs, numbers, etc. will make people feel less pissed.

I guess I didn't really have a conclusion when I started this post...just wanted to comment on that graphic, I guess. Lol.

kdogground2
02-25-2012, 06:28 PM
And let's be clear, I perfectly understand how game development works and why this day one DLC exists. I'm not upset about that or joining the "boycott". I just think it's shitty that two years ago, we got bonus content for free as thanks for buying the game, and this time around, they put in a tacked on boring horde mode so they could "generously" give us an online pass instead.

Not that giving something free once should set a standard so they always have to give free stuff but have they actually said you won't get anything for inputting the online pass this time? All I have seen is people assuming they won't because it has an online mode now.

And I don't see a problem with online passes. If you buy the game 2nd hand you probly saved the cost of it or more anyway. If you buy it new it takes like about 30 seconds to input the code.

First of all, whoever made this graphic has too much free time on their hands.

Second, despite the middle part being overly exaggerated for effect, I think it's insulting and probably applies to your general, prepubescent and/or casual gamer. Most serious gamers know that's not how the schedule goes.

Third, basic psychology: emotions always trumps logic. No amount of charts, graphs, numbers, etc. will make people feel less pissed.

I guess I didn't really have a conclusion when I started this post...just wanted to comment on that graphic, I guess. Lol.

No idea who made it. Saw it on kotaku.

2nd. I thought it would be like that too but most people seem to think when a game is finished the developers bring out the wheel of misfortune to decide what content to remove and sell later and that no extra work goes into it.

I like the graphic because it simply points out that additinal work goes into DLC and they aren't just getting screwed out of extra money.

mjc0961
02-26-2012, 02:15 AM
Not that giving something free once should set a standard so they always have to give free stuff but have they actually said you won't get anything for inputting the online pass this time? All I have seen is people assuming they won't because it has an online mode now.

And I don't see a problem with online passes. If you buy the game 2nd hand you probly saved the cost of it or more anyway. If you buy it new it takes like about 30 seconds to input the code.

I didn't say it should set a standard either. I just said it sucks that we went from Project 10 Dollar to Online Pass.

And I have a huge problem with online passes. They want people to buy the games new, so what do they do? Give new game buyers the raw end of the deal. If you buy used, you take a very short amount of time to buy the online pass and download it, no codes required. If you buy new, you have to input the code. You have to hope the code is still valid. You have to hope the code isn't misprinted. And if there are any problems entering it, you have to spend god knows how long on the phone with customer service when you should be playing the game you just spent $60 on.

If these publishers want people to buy new, they should stop treating the new buyers like shit. Used game buyers should be the one made to suffer inconveniences, not the new game buyers.

xXmyxxmastaXx
02-26-2012, 02:41 AM
mass effect has over 1 mil preorders in the us alone so this boycott wont work

kdogground2
02-26-2012, 09:32 AM
I didn't say it should set a standard either. I just said it sucks that we went from Project 10 Dollar to Online Pass.

And I have a huge problem with online passes. They want people to buy the games new, so what do they do? Give new game buyers the raw end of the deal. If you buy used, you take a very short amount of time to buy the online pass and download it, no codes required. If you buy new, you have to input the code. You have to hope the code is still valid. You have to hope the code isn't misprinted. And if there are any problems entering it, you have to spend god knows how long on the phone with customer service when you should be playing the game you just spent $60 on.

If these publishers want people to buy new, they should stop treating the new buyers like shit. Used game buyers should be the one made to suffer inconveniences, not the new game buyers.

I have no problem with online pass. Even when I buy a new copy of a game thats been out for ages the code it still valid. It takes about 30 seconds to put in the code. Less if you plug in a keyboard. It isn't getting the raw end of the deal. Admitadly a miss printed one would be annoying as hell but thats the rare exception. Not the rule.

And how are they ment to do it another way? New buyers just put in a code and they are away. people buying used need to buy the online pass meaning the developers actually get some money for the purchase. How else could they do this?

iBuzz7S
02-26-2012, 09:52 AM
mass effect has over 1 mil preorders in the us alone so this boycott wont work
How many are paid off? How many of them will be paid off on launch? How many will cancel?

Pre-order numbers in no way determine the number of sold copies.

PhantomNemesis
02-26-2012, 12:53 PM
I'm assuming since the video is gone that this was the one by TotalBiscuit, remember that he is primarily PC gamer and they rarely have this situation as most developers worth buying games from on the PC give DLC for free or do it all post-launch and after the bug fixes.

I pre-ordered the N7 edition the very day it was available on the GAME website. However, I do agree with TB that this is something controversial, the fact is that limiting this kind of content to the CE and making others pay for it is different compared to pre-order weapons of characters with no real impact on the game.

The Protheans are the whole reason the universe knows of the Reaper threat, and the constant reminder that what was thought the be the most technically advanced species at the time was wiped out by the Reapers. To have a Prothean still alive and capable of being a squad mate in the game is vastly different from say, Sebastian in DA2, who overall had little impact to the game aside from a few quests and some dialogue you wouldn't otherwise hear.

If the Prothean squad mate came with any new copy of the game, that's fine. But being free to N7 and Digital Deluxe orders only isn't really acceptable, unless the impact to the game is so insignificant that the DLC is almost insignificant, and does anyone expect that to happen with probably the last living Prothean joining Shepard?

As for that chart, TotalBiscuit made a comment on it which is entirely true, I'll put the link in to his FB page where he made it. Everything he says is true, this DLC isn't going to make or break a developer's job, this is Mass Effect from Bioware, not an indie game made by someone in his bedroom. Also MP was outed from very early on as being in the game, its not Project Ten Dollar like Zaeed which was made in the last stages.

http://www.facebook.com/cynicalbrit/posts/333028400072644

I'm not going to boycott the game, I like it too much to change my view and having had the N7 edition pre-ordered was close to 9 months this problem isn't going to affect me. However, that doesn't mean its good business practice, and EA/Bioware should really consider if this is going to really boost their profits if people are going to at least hesitate before they pick the game up.

kdogground2
02-26-2012, 01:43 PM
Limiting it to CE and making others pay for it? What do you think as getting the CE did? We payed more for the extras because we wanted them. Bioware relized that not everyone who wanted a CE could get one and others would want the DLC. So they made the DLC avaliable at a cost that is fair enough without screwing over the people who got the CE.

Yes the protheans are the reason people know about the reaper threat but when the reapers attacked they didn't know what the hell was going on and started to get wiped out with some of thier greatest scientists managing to pass on the info.

The Prothean we get? He could just be a non informed soldier, a farmer or just some random person who hid in the facility that stored him for all them years. Theres nothing saying he will know anything that could change the fate of the universe. Hell with him being frozen (I assume) for so long he might not remember anything at all.

Why is it coming with all copys of the game fine? That assumes it is of vital importance and was removed from the game. This is DLC what was planned to go with CE. Not a removed, vital storyline that will change our entire understanding of the whole game.

And sure for Bioware they might not lose jobs and just move on to another job but when it comes time to do more DLC in a month or so when all the people complaining about day 1 DLC day they want some they will all be to busy to make it. And the customers are always trying to get the most for less. If this works against bioware whats to stop people doing the exact same for smaller companys that would get fired?

The real problem is that people now expect a constant stream of DLC after a games released but they expect it all to be either free or a basicly a game in itself.

And this is a good buisness practice. They knew people would want it after they found out the CE got a prothean so they set it up so they could have it. Being in the UK you should know how annoying it is when say America gets a game or DLC you want and we don't (assuming not region free)

The problem is Bioware did too good a job and made a DLC that too many people want but they aren't willing to pay for it.

H2O
02-26-2012, 02:14 PM
The Protheans are the whole reason the universe knows of the Reaper threat, and the constant reminder that what was thought the be the most technically advanced species at the time was wiped out by the Reapers. To have a Prothean still alive and capable of being a squad mate in the game is vastly different from say, Sebastian in DA2, who overall had little impact to the game aside from a few quests and some dialogue you wouldn't otherwise hear.
.

This Prothean... The few pictures i've seen look like a collector. Is that what we're getting?

Because while the species origin is the same a collector prothean has been genetically engineered and subjugated by the reapers. I.e. there's a large likelihood it's not going to know much more ancient history than anyone else.

Edit: Never mind, found the info i was looking for. He's an original who's been in stasis for over 50k years.

His knowledge could still be quite limited though depending on exactly when he went into stasis and his prior vocation.

If any of us were stuck in stasis how much really useful information could we provide about our society...

PhantomNemesis
02-26-2012, 02:24 PM
Why does the CE have to feature game content that others have to pay for? Nearly every CE I've seen over the past few years will just be a soundtrack, art book, making of DVD and at most an exclusive weapon or something trivial to the game. An entire DLC giving a very interesting character is a step above that, there were enough extras already to entice us fans to get the CE. Also, the fact is that its only been in recent weeks that it has been made known that From Ashes was for the N7 and Digital Deluxe editions only, and for the past few months most retailers have filled their pre-orders for N7. Anyone who decide to get the N7 based on this news is already too late.

Presumably the Protheans are the first race that decided to pass on a message to anyone who would be able to hear it about the Reaper threat. This character was presumably alive at the time of the annihilation of the Protheans and isn't some kind of clone etc. The amount of lore and general fan-service here would give more information on the Reapers and Protheans than the first two games and all the books put together. This Prothean character is more than just a squad mate, but a big part of filling in the background of the Mass Effect franchise. The fact is, they must have some significance and remember past events or having the Prothean in the first place is a pointless idea.

Being bundled with the special editions only might not make it pivotal to the story, but it certainly adds more to the game than most DLC in Mass Effect. Aside from Lair of the Shadow Broker the other DLC has had no impact on the franchise, but I'd be willing to bet that this DLC will, otherwise why have a Prothean squad mate?

If a small company wants to do this practice, then fine, but its already been established that this game won't be the make of break, why does Bioware need to do this when smaller companies have no need?

Post-release DLC should not be free, but Day One DLC should really be included in Project Ten Dollar. Day One DLC is started by artists who have done their part on the game and need something to do, so they create some ideas with the creative directors and have some plans ready.
When the game goes to gold 3-4 weeks ahead of release, Day One DLC goes into production, and is completed before the game release. This DLC is ready by game launch and is accessible on the day, where it should really be included in the online pass.

It's very rare in modern times that a DLC or game is released in one region that isn't going to be released in another region. This occurs mostly in Japan where many games may not appeal to the mass market of Westerners and so aren't released due to no real profit gain. Is it really fair for Bioware to dangle a paid DLC in front of those buying the standard edition and saying "This is really good, ask your friend who got the CE, he got it for free, you need to pay though, the CE was sold out months ago!"?

For your final point, until we see reviews that include this DLC, we can't say its good or bad. The premise of it is good, and is a great bit of fan-service, but it could be a horrible piece of DLC that is as much canon as Mass Effect: Deception, especially being made by an outside team to Bioware. The problem is that people shouldn't be paying for it in the first place, it should be included in the online pass or released as post-release DLC which is paid for by everyone. If it was released as post-release DLC I'd gladly pay for it, as I have done with every other bit of ME DLC, but being free to me for buying the N7 and not free to someone who buys the standard game new is something that I don't find acceptable at all.


This Prothean... The few pictures i've seen look like a collector. Is that what we're getting?

Because while the species origin is the same a collector prothean has been genetically engineered and subjugated by the reapers. I.e. there's a large likelihood it's not going to know much more ancient history than anyone else.




The Collectors have become mindless thralls that would not survive without the Reapers. This Prothean is either cloned from some shred of Prothean DNA, or has been in stasis for 50k years, and even if it was a farmer or someone with no real knowledge, they would have at least an anecdote of the Reaper attacks, reports from Prothean media etc. With only a limited number of pods this is going to be someone of relative importance to Prothean society anyway, if you watch any doomsday film the first people to be in the underground bunker are the scientists, Presidents etc.

littlejay
02-26-2012, 02:32 PM
Why do people keep saying EA? Bioware makes the games. EA probably helps with online servers so the online pass comes in there. But EA does not make dlc.

Burnout x360a
02-26-2012, 02:39 PM
Why do people keep saying EA? Bioware makes the games. EA probably helps with online servers so the online pass comes in there. But EA does not make dlc.

They don't develop the DLC no but they are responsible for how it is priced as well as when it'll be released and how said DLC will be distributed or sold. (i.e. In a collectors/special edition, tied to a pass or day one release etc.)

kdogground2
02-26-2012, 03:34 PM
Why shouldn't the CE contain content others had to pay for? When I ordered my CE months ago I saw listed - Additinal Character + Mission. I didn't know who or what it is. Could have been a boring human character. Could have been the hanar BLASTO! or it could have been a Vorcha (what I want more than a prothean). Either way I wanted it and the other stuff so I payed extra to get them. Why should people then get some of that stuff free because they want it but don't want to pay for it?

From the wiki...

Following contingency planning, Vigil began cutting power to the pods of non-essential staff to conserve energy. When the Reapers finally withdrew through the Citadel relay, only the top researchers — a dozen individuals — were left. Vigil woke them, and the scientists pieced together what had happened.
They soon realised the situation was dire. Without sufficient numbers to sustain a viable population, the Prothean species was doomed. Desperate for contact with others of their kind, a carefully-coded signal was sent to the beacons on other planets. Though it was unlikely there were other survivors, the scientists thought it was worth the risk to try reaching them. The signal not only contained a warning of the Reaper invasion, but a description of Ilos itself, to give them hope.
However, the surviving Prothean scientists knew that rescue was unlikely. Instead, they chose to protect the races they had been studying, spared destruction due to their lack of advancement, and began working out where the Reapers had come from, and how. After decades of study, they worked out the connection between the Reapers, the Citadel, and the keepers (http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Keepers), and discovered a way to interfere with the signal that compels the keepers to activate the Citadel relay. Using the Conduit, the Prothean scientists left Ilos, travelled to the Citadel and altered this signal. Their intention was to prevent the Reapers from opening the Citadel relay again, and trap them in dark space, but they had no way to be certain their plan had succeeded.
These were the top scientists. They were the best minds of the protheans who managed to create the Conduit and sent the warning. If you read more at the wiki you will know they only survived because the data on Ilos was gone and they went into Stasis to avoid detection. The Prothean the DLC gives us also must have went into Stasis but he never got out of it (till now) Meaning he never got the warning the researchers sent or know anything they figured out. All he will know is something is killing and capturing his people.

Tha Kasumi DLC added little to the franchise as far as I remember. Why was it added? because it was fun. I enjoyed the mission and the statues and comments she makes are intresting and amusing. Why add a Prothean? Because they thought we might enjoy having a Prothean squad member even if he adds little to the story.

It's fine because it's a big company? isn't it that attitude that caused things like online passes and such?

Project 10 dollar is basicly give free DLC to people who buy the game new. While I do like the idea and it would make a few more people buy the game new why should the company? They are putting in extra work to give people something for free when if they are getting nothing back from it why do the work? Or worse. They could actually just finish the game and then strip something from it and only give access to it with an online pass.

I would much rather pay some extra on day 1 for DLC I want than have that happen.

And it isn't that rare. ME2 had a NA Dr. Pepper promotion giving free DLC. Codes might have worked universally but yeah. FFXIII-2 also did it. Japan got unique japan only DLC weapons and NA got diffrent NA only DLC weapons. So it's not that rare. And if anything the people who got the CE got it at a reduced price not free.

Yes no one knows if it will be good or bad or what it will contain. Everyone is just making assumptions and are getting themself worked up on these assumptions acting like this DLC will answer every question about the ME series and the actual game will just be a quick run and gun to the end.

And they should need to pay for it. It isn't part of the game. If they weren't putting it in the CE the wouldn't have made it at all. They should be happy they are being given a chance to get it at all.

And why do you not find it acceptable? You paid 70($105) for the game + extra content.

Someone else then pays 40($60) for the game. Why should they get some of the content that you payed for for free?

PhantomNemesis
02-26-2012, 04:17 PM
A CE should not have content exclusive to the game that others have to pay for, at the most an extra DLC weapon but something as big as a mission or character is unacceptable. Deus Ex: Human Revolution had a DLC pack that featured a mission that although wasn't pivotal to story progression, it was enough that people who didn't get the pack may have been confused when they saw an extra character in a cut scene with no context on who he was or why he was there. The situation here isn't entirely dissimilar, a character exclusive to those who ordered from a particular retailer or ordered a particular edition, and the rest have to pay for it from XBL.

The Kasumi DLC was post-release DLC that wouldn't have been able to add anything the franchise what with little story progression after the endgame. It is a fairly generic character with small development and has little to offer because of it. This Prothean will have some idea of the Reaper invasion, he is a source of intelligence that no one else can match. Before going in to stasis he would've had some idea on the Reapers, not about the connection between the Keepers, Citadel and Reapers, but they would have fought the Reapers in some capacity, and perhaps know weaknesses, strengths etc. This Prothean is also able to give lore on Prothean society before their extinction, thats a lot of lore/fan-service that will add to the franchise.

Because Bioware is a big company, making a game guaranteed to be successful to some degree, there is no reason why they should be using this business practice as the game is a guaranteed chart topper in multiple regions. I never said that its okay to do anything because they're a big company, the reason they're big is because they've made some brilliant games that always sold well, and there was never any of this nonsense that the gamers needed to be incentivised to buy games and special editions.

The whole reason Project Ten Dollar exists is so that gamers are encouraged to buy new. Why should gamers be encouraged to buy new, and then asked to jump another hurdle to buy a game because they didn't pre-order 9 months ago and buy some special edition because they didn't want to pay 30 more for an art book, soundtrack and a special case? If it wasn't the fact it was a Mass Effect game I wouldn't have pre-ordered, nor bought the N7 edition.

I'm sure there has been a few companies that have been cheeky enough to strip something from the game already. I can't give proof in an example because it would've been known and reported as the scandal of the decade by media outlets. But, I'm sure theres a few games that have had this happen already.

The Dr.Pepper codes and FFXIII-2 were weapons and armour, which is very different compared to a squad mate. If this was just some assault rifle or armour then this controversy would never have occurred in the first place. A squad mate could likely come with exclusive missions that add to the story of the game, as well as character development and overall game time. A weapon if anything will reduce game time by being too powerful and making the game easier, there is the difference.

If it was only being added to the game just for CE gamers to have bragging rights of getting it for free, why have it in the first place? The whole reason why this DLC exists is because it has some implication to the overall franchise, if it is that inconsequential then why waste time and money making it through an outside development team, when gamers have enough reason to buy the CE as it is. If it is that pointless a DLC I would rather they scrap the entire thing and work on something with more depth to it, and make it available to everyone due to it being useful to more than part of the fan base.

I paid 70 for the N7 edition, because I wanted the art book, soundtrack and all the other little bits of non-game related content in the box, the arsenal packs and the little robot dog thingy will be redeemed by me but never used, especially if it makes the game easier. I bought the CE for both ME1 and ME2 and just wanted to have all three sitting by me to show my support for Bioware. I do not expect extra content that excludes me from others purely because I decided to pre-order a game 9 months ago, and as we've seen from the changes between ME1 and ME2, I might like the game when its released and could've wasted good money.

If someone wants to get by with the standard edition they should be able to do so, and they should not need to fork out an extra $10 on release day to get the same enjoyment from the game as I do.

kdogground2
02-26-2012, 05:25 PM
The deus Ex thing is quite diffrent. If you don't have the DLC the Prothean won't show up up in cut scenes. He won't just appear as a NPC talking about something you don't get since you didn't play the DLC. Without the DLC he won't exist.

Post release doesn't matter. I don't see why people feel getting it weeks/months later makes it better and end game? The character fits in well at the start when you are being sent to recruit. It wouldn't feel like end game after the whole game is done.

Why would he know any of that? For the Protheans the Reapers came out of nowhere and started claughtering and kidnapping them. They tried to surrender many times(suggesting they couldn't fight back) but were ignored. For all we know he was a common Prothean who fell into the stasis chamber ala futurama right before the reapers attacked.

And even with culture and society even without the DLC we might find some new non raided or destroyed Prothean ruins that give us even more info.

Alot of people do think it's fine though. It's a big buisness who make lots of money it's fine if I get stuff free. And who has said this won't be another great game? It the game is good it will be good with or without the DLC. Making DLC you think your fans will want isn't a bad thing.

Yes I am sure some games have cut content and sold it again as DLC. Sadly you can't really proove it without someone who worked on the game admiting it. The whole claiming that all games do this with DLC doesn't help either.

The point of the Dr. Pepper and FFXIII-2 bits is they made content and only gave it to a select few. The rest of us don't even have the option to buy them if we want them what they are trying not to do with this DLC by offering it to everyone.

It isn't bragging right or free. We paid extra to get this content, the character isn't multiplayer and as we still know basicly nothing he might not be worth using.(He's no krogan) We have it because it's an intresting extra. Even if I didn't get it in the CE i'd buy it. Why? Because I want the additinal content.

Yes DLC is about money. However it's also about giving more content to thier customers. Thier goal is to make a DLC that we want enough to buy so they can pay everything related in making it.

Getting rid of DLC won't mean we will get more in games or this extra content for free. Just means we won't get it at all.

I paid 70 for the CE because I knew I was getting the game, I always buy new when possible and after looking over the extra content (character included) I wanted them too. I expect to get all the content offered there.

Why should someone who didn't pay the extra for the content now get it for free because it's ready by release? By same standard I should get the Collector Rifle. I didn't buy the ME3 artbook that the DLC is given with but I did pay for a ME3 Artbook. (No I do not really believe I should ge the DLC it's just the same thing)

They should need to pay extra to get the extra content.

They paid 40 for the game. You paid 70 for the game. In that extra 30 you spent is the cost for this DLC they don't want to pay.

Hot Juicy Pie
02-26-2012, 05:58 PM
The only thing I'm getting from this thread is that some people just have an innate need to complain about things.

If it's not one thing it's another.

I mean really? What's the big deal anymore? We all knew that the DLC was going to be in the CE, which is fine. But now everyone is in an uproar because it is available first day as payable DLC for those who couldn't get CE? I just don't understand.

And for those who say that CE is unobtainable now... give it a week after launch. Shelves will be loaded with copies... I've seen this same marketing ploy time and time again with the Halo series, Dragon Age, ME2, etc... It's simply to build a demand.

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/096/044/trollface.jpg?1296494117

PhantomNemesis
02-26-2012, 06:44 PM
This isn't just a complaint for the sake of complaining, this is because some people clearly think that they aren't getting value for money from a game they want the most out of and enjoy. I feel that this something that should not be paid for for reasons stated above, clearly others disagree, but in the end if people don't mind paying for it then thats that. I just hope no one else adopts this strategy since I'm not looking forward to paying extra on release because I didn't get what is in many cases an overpriced CE, for a game I may not necessarily like.

Valiantheart
02-26-2012, 07:22 PM
Boycotting the game or havinga whiney fit over day 1 DLC is stupid and pointless. When they finally cave in and buy the game this will be me pointing at them...

Nelson - YouTube

Hoborg
02-26-2012, 07:26 PM
You can stop discussing this now. Boycotts of video games don't work. And honestly, people complaining about EA should take a good fucking look at Activision. Killing off new IP's in favor of annual entertainment (aka milking the shit out of CoD).

I bought ME2 3 times, no joke. For every copy of ME3 you boycott, I will buy it at least 2 times.

tripleb2k
02-26-2012, 08:01 PM
OP: Want to start an argument on the internet? 1) State your opinion. 2) Wait.
What did you think you would accomplish by coming onto a thread that is filled with people that want to play this game and complain about it? Of course you're gonna anger people and bring out opinions different from your own. Welcome to the world wide web. You can't be that naive.
And don't call people who have opinions different from yours kids. Just makes your opinion and arguments juvenile.

xXmyxxmastaXx
02-26-2012, 08:06 PM
You can stop discussing this now. Boycotts of video games don't work. And honestly, people complaining about EA should take a good fucking look at Activision. Killing off new IP's in favor of annual entertainment (aka milking the shit out of CoD).

I bought ME2 3 times, no joke. For every copy of ME3 you boycott, I will buy it at least 2 times.

i wonder why doesnt activision do day 1 unlocks for guns and a online pass like ea

RDrules
02-26-2012, 09:18 PM
i wonder why doesnt activision do day 1 unlocks for guns and a online pass like ea

no they just sell an elite service for 4000 ms points a year ;)

Yaymez
02-27-2012, 11:18 AM
How many are paid off? How many of them will be paid off on launch? How many will cancel?

Pre-order numbers in no way determine the number of sold copies.

I'm gonna pull my selfish card now and say, I don't give a rats ass if people decide to cancel their pre-orders. It will be sad to see and more of a comment on the person cancelling than the company distributing and pricing the game, but ultimately it won't impact or prevent me from getting my hands on the game on day one, getting the DLC and enjoying it from start to finish.

So while a big group of disgruntled people who might not necessarily grasp the effort that goes into making these things are sitting there wallowing in their own anger complaining about the injustice and evil of the way DLC is priced, an even bigger group of people will be sitting back with a beer and a pizza enjoying the shit out of what is shaping up to be an outstanding game and its bonus Prothean crew member.

Hoborg
02-27-2012, 06:27 PM
People have their priorities screwed up. Need to worry about something EA/Bioware related? Worry about the sad state of SWTOR and the inevitable mass exodus come spring/early summer.

There's something you can legitimately bitch about.

mikeymud
02-27-2012, 06:41 PM
I'm kinda glad to see that this sense of entitlement for more free stuff isn't limited to the US. I pre-ordered the Collector's Edition, and don't see how something I've paid extra for - amongst other things - should be free of charge for those people that didn't. Furthermore, the amount of free extras that you can get through other means (Facebook apps, playing the ME3 demo, playing the Kingdoms of Amalur demo) seem to go ignored here.

Anyhow, it looks like that strategy of teaching EA/Bioware a lession about their marketing schemes does not appear to be working, as pre-orders for ME3 have surpassed those for ME2:

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/mass-effect-3-pre-orders-smash-targets/091840

How's that hopey-changey/boycotty thing workin' out for ya? (wink)

Burnout x360a
02-27-2012, 06:50 PM
I'm kinda glad to see that this sense of entitlement for more free stuff isn't limited to the US. I pre-ordered the Collector's Edition, and don't see how something I've paid extra for - amongst other things - should be free of charge for those people that didn't. Furthermore, the amount of free extras that you can get through other means (Facebook apps, playing the ME3 demo, playing the Kingdoms of Amalur demo) seem to go ignored here.


I wouldn't like them giving away something that the CE buyers paid extra to get amongst other things. It's fair game at 800MSP.

Thing is, people are quick to claim that this 'day one DLC' was taken out (and therefore they have to buy it to have the full story) when in reality how many people have actually played it to make that judgement? Oh wait..

Hoborg
02-27-2012, 06:55 PM
Here's a shocking revelation. Online passes don't bother me. Why? Because I buy games new and I support the industry. Cheap bastards.

Rivercurse
02-27-2012, 07:48 PM
Here's a shocking revelation. Online passes don't bother me. Why? Because I buy games new and I support the industry. Cheap bastards.

But you hate every single game that you buy.. Why bother? *trollface*

"X"
02-27-2012, 08:03 PM
Bioware should give in and don't do the ashes DLC at all. Make it CE only.

Lets see how many people keep complaining about the day 1 dlc then. Bet it'll change up pretty quick to "let us have it at a reduced price" or "give it to us for free".

RDrules
02-27-2012, 08:59 PM
Bioware should give in and don't do the ashes DLC at all. Make it CE only.

Lets see how many people keep complaining about the day 1 dlc then. Bet it'll change up pretty quick to "let us have it at a reduced price" or "give it to us for free".

that would be a very amusing move if they did :D

Rivercurse
02-27-2012, 09:05 PM
Bioware should give in and don't do the ashes DLC at all. Make it CE only.

Lets see how many people keep complaining about the day 1 dlc then. Bet it'll change up pretty quick to "let us have it at a reduced price" or "give it to us for free".

Post of the week!

Vindicator51
02-27-2012, 09:27 PM
Bioware should give in and don't do the ashes DLC at all. Make it CE only.

Lets see how many people keep complaining about the day 1 dlc then. Bet it'll change up pretty quick to "let us have it at a reduced price" or "give it to us for free".

That's actually a fantastic idea. Keep it CE only, then they're not selling it to the sheep.

13ip0lar
02-27-2012, 10:00 PM
That's actually a fantastic idea. Keep it CE only, then they're not selling it to the sheep.

God I hate sheep...

HolyMoses81
02-28-2012, 11:10 AM
I'll definitely keep boycotting EA as far as possible, but actually with ME3 I made an exception, as I definetly won't miss out on an excellent story Bioware once - when they didn't work for gaming business' biggest assholes - started to tell.
But the usual EA-crap like SSX or games like Dante's Inferno or any EA-sprots games won't make it into my XBox anymore (at least not if I can't buy them used).

Yaymez
02-28-2012, 11:53 AM
I'll definitely keep boycotting EA as far as possible, but actually with ME3 I made an exception, as I definetly won't miss out on an excellent story Bioware once - when they didn't work for gaming business' biggest assholes - started to tell.
But the usual EA-crap like SSX or games like Dante's Inferno or any EA-sprots games won't make it into my XBox anymore (at least not if I can't buy them used).

So you will boycott EA until they release a game like you really like, then you'll take a well deserved break from boycotting until you are done or if you can get them dirt-cheap...

You aren't boycotting a company if you keep buying from them whenever you decide they release a game you like, because in doing this you are contradicting your very attitude towards EA. If you truly want to do this you'd need to have not played or bought a few games on your games list, such as Dead Space 1 & 2, Alice and Mass Effect 2 on there.

Maybe edit this to:

"I have a love/hate relationship with EA. I love some of the games they distribute, but I hate the way they price some of them."

BrassBallz
02-28-2012, 06:16 PM
Boycott COD.... play Mass Effect 3.

niko da bos
02-28-2012, 10:27 PM
Boycott COD.... play Mass Effect 3.

^^^^
lol COD syndrome. its amazing the ammount of COD fans that complain about each game that is released, somehow hoping that the next game will magically be better? NO, it never is. but that doesnt stop it from becoming "shooter of the year." trololol

although this thread is very comical:p, my only issue with EA is their crap ass severs. i was a little upset when i realized they would be running the MP. it takes me around 15-20 seconds to connect to the server when i turn on the game, several times i have "lost connection to game." also, they have a very bad rep with their servers. they either constantly go down, or EA closes them like 1-2 years after the game comes out.

MintyModF1
02-28-2012, 11:29 PM
I am happy they are releasing this DLC. I have no plans on purchasing the CE so I don't need to worry about how I can play the DLC!

DEG23
02-29-2012, 12:45 AM
This thread is full of lol's:p

I am at a loss why people complain about DLC prices and companies like EA's business practises. I always assumed that the average person had enough brain cells to self determine what they would consider a good deal and what they would consider a rip off.

If you have preordered ME3 but no longer feel you are receiving a worth while deal, why not simply cancel your preorder? Like all protest groups, complaining on the internet doesn't change the world.

Quickdraw
02-29-2012, 01:13 AM
I really dont understand all the complaining, been looking over countless threads on bsn and its just nuts, but these three just stick out.

When the ce was announced to have extra squad member and misson wasn't so much of a big deal back then, but prothean i can understand they have a huge part in me lore, however that fact standard copies are allowed to buy it day one to me i would have expected people to be happy than having to say wait months before standard copies get it keeping exclusivity to ce.


less than a week and people are getting so upset over silly things.

If your upset about the dlc being a rip off fine don't buy it wait for it to drop which is unlikely, but me3 is still a really good game regardless of this issue.

next are complaints about the ending so many people taking what people say on the internet as facts just boggles me, anyone could make up anything and its fact until people play it. all this script hacking and finding stuff there, surely sometimes code gets left in and forgotten which then people find get upset and just gets people riled up.

DLC goodies for online pass, i can understand the reason behind it stopping second hand sales so forth, but people claiming extra goodies on top of the multiplayer just seems greedy, i can understand if people don't have internet access or don't like mp then its a waste. since me2 didnt have mp as extra stuff was the only way to stop second hand retailers. makes sense to me =/.

Myself won't be boycotting as ive been waiting for this and am to hyped not to, but people really need to see the bigger picture before making a big deal, these things are mostly EA publisher power in play here, if you have any beef with anyone take it up with them.

13ip0lar
02-29-2012, 01:28 AM
I was just explaining the situation to my friend. It's people being stupid. First people were pissed that development time and budget were likely used to make this day 1 DLC. However, even when they got day 1 DLC for free via the Cerberus Network in ME2, they still bitched. Now they get no free DLC, and instead swapped that out for a MP online pass. They were going to make the day 1 DLC a CE exclusive, which the majority of people seemed alright with, even though in the end people would bitch that it's not fair and they should at least be able to purchase it.

So instead of doing this retard dance BioWare/EA just skipped to the end and made it available for purchase if people still wanted it. In the end any way this situation plays out people won't be happy. God I hate people...

Quickdraw
02-29-2012, 09:02 AM
I was just explaining the situation to my friend. It's people being stupid. First people were pissed that development time and budget were likely used to make this day 1 DLC. However, even when they got day 1 DLC for free via the Cerberus Network in ME2, they still bitched. Now they get no free DLC, and instead swapped that out for a MP online pass. They were going to make the day 1 DLC a CE exclusive, which the majority of people seemed alright with, even though in the end people would bitch that it's not fair and they should at least be able to purchase it.

So instead of doing this retard dance BioWare/EA just skipped to the end and made it available for purchase if people still wanted it. In the end any way this situation plays out people won't be happy. God I hate people...

I kinda figured there would be day one dlc not cause of extra profit just cause the fact the ce includes it, i get a lot of ce for games but half the stuff rarely gets used out of the list of stuff from the ce im only interested in ;



Premium metal case featuring commemorative artwork of Commander Shepard
A full collection of in-game content that can't be found anywhere else

N7 Arsenal Pack - Bring the firepower with the N7 Sniper Rifle, Shotgun, SMG, and Pistol
Robotic Dog - A faithful sidekick to keep you company on board the Normandy
Squadmate Alternate Outfit Pack - New appearances for your favorite squad members
N7 Hoodie - For Commander Shepard's casual days on board the Normandy


Mass Effect 3 with the digital soundtrack
DLC misson and character

Pricewise all that stuff probably is not worth the extra money i paid, i generally prefer things ingame as they don't take up space in gaming area.


i really dont understand why the fabric patch its something i dont think most people would even use. also dislike the fact the soundtrack is digital prefer disk copy guess ill boycott! :O just kidding.

MASS DOMINATION
02-29-2012, 11:32 AM
People always get mad about day one dlc. Usually it comes free to those that buy the game new or buy the special edition. But even then people get pissed. ME3 doesn't have an online pass. It doesn't even have a Cerberus Network that costs $15. Instead there is just one mission and character that comes with the CE. EA/Bioware then decided to make it open to everyone at a $10 fee which basically equates to an online pass that 90% of games have nowadays.

I'm perfectly fine with this. People don't seem to understand that buying games used gives absolutely no money to the people that spent years trying to create worthwhile entertainment for you. You may as well pirate the game for the all developer cares. Either way they still make nothing off their work. I'm not against people buying used but you need to understand that the developer is trying to make money off their product. Day one DLC typically isn't even created until the game is finished. Believe it or not, it's not actually content that was held back so they could charge you extra later. Of course their are exceptions to the rule but for the most part it works that.

Read this info directly from Casey Hudson (the dude behind ME3)

"It takes about 3 months from "content complete" to bug-fix, certify, manufacture, and ship game discs. In that time we work on DLC.

DLC has fast cert and no mfg., so if a team works very hard, they can get a DLC done in time to enjoy it with your 1st playthrough on day 1.

On #ME3, content creators completed the game in January & moved onto the "From Ashes" DLC, free w/ the CE or you can buy seperately."

Tai_MT
02-29-2012, 02:28 PM
People always get mad about day one dlc. Usually it comes free to those that buy the game new or buy the special edition. But even then people get pissed. ME3 doesn't have an online pass. It doesn't even have a Cerberus Network that costs $15. Instead there is just one mission and character that comes with the CE. EA/Bioware then decided to make it open to everyone at a $10 fee which basically equates to an online pass that 90% of games have nowadays.

I'm perfectly fine with this. People don't seem to understand that buying games used gives absolutely no money to the people that spent years trying to create worthwhile entertainment for you. You may as well pirate the game for the all developer cares. Either way they still make nothing off their work. I'm not against people buying used but you need to understand that the developer is trying to make money off their product. Day one DLC typically isn't even created until the game is finished. Believe it or not, it's not actually content that was held back so they could charge you extra later. Of course their are exceptions to the rule but for the most part it works that.

Read this info directly from Casey Hudson (the dude behind ME3)

"It takes about 3 months from "content complete" to bug-fix, certify, manufacture, and ship game discs. In that time we work on DLC.

DLC has fast cert and no mfg., so if a team works very hard, they can get a DLC done in time to enjoy it with your 1st playthrough on day 1.

On #ME3, content creators completed the game in January & moved onto the "From Ashes" DLC, free w/ the CE or you can buy seperately."


I have to take this occasion to take issue with ONE small thing you've said. It's not against you, don't misunderstand. It's just... I hear the argument a lot in defense of the "online pass" thing, and it bothers me because nobody ever brings this up...

The online pass is supposed to "stop used game sales", correct? Why does this need to happen? To quote those that defend it... "Because the game company doesn't get money from the used sale purchase". What? They don't? I'm sorry, that's pretty wrong there.

I buy a game. Buy it new. My money goes to the store and goes to the developers and everyone else. I decide I don't like the game. So, I sell it or turn it in for store credit (at a SEVERELY reduced price that the store will jack up later) which make it "used". Now someone else comes along and wants to buy it cheap, so they buy my "used" copy. How has the publisher lost anything? They already got the money from MY COPY of the game. Do they expect to make money from my copy TWICE? That seems a little fishy to me. I doubt a company "loses money" from the "used games" buying crowd. After all, every game that is bought "used" was once "new" and paid in full. They already got the money from that game that could've been made.

I've yet to see this argument come up, and I've yet to see ANY kind of defense. The tactic of "online passes" was created in order to make sure they didn't LOSE MONEY on SHITTY GAMES. That's it, nothing more. If a game has a lot of copies go to the "used" or "bargain bin", that game did pretty terrible to begin with. Nobody wanted it. So, if there's a LOT of these "used" games to be bought by other people... It shows how bad the game was and how little it sold.

Now, if a game has FEW copies that end up being turned in for store credit or "used", then they wouldn't need to worry about people buying "used" games, would they? They'd have already made a massive killing on the game originally.

See what I'm getting at? They want to do the "online pass" stuff, not to get the "much needed" money, but in order to prevent losses on stupid business decisions (like releasing a crappy unplayable game that nobody wants). A great game will have a negligable amount of "used" copies sold, and a crappy game will have a massive amount of them sold.

They are BASICALLY selling the same copy of the game twice. The game was already bought "new" once. They got all their money from that. Now the game is "used" because someone turned it in, and a player isn't willing to pay "full price" for a NEW game, so they take their chances with the "used" version at a discounted price, and they want to charge this NEW PERSON full price for a copy of the game SOMEONE ELSE already paid full price for.

It's the equivalent of standing in line with your friend and buying him something. Then handing it to him once you paid for it. The cashier sees this and then charges your friend full price for it as well, even though you ALREADY PAID FOR IT.

"Online passes" are a dick move. They are a "money grubbing" scheme. There's no way around that. No logical way to defend it.

Ham Woopan
02-29-2012, 03:56 PM
Sometimes I hate being a gamer. The gaming community as a whole is full of whiny self-intitled babies. I laughed when people tried to boycott Left 4 Dead 2 and I'm still laughing now. Instead of boycotting why don't you get your point across by fasting? Because only then will EA sit up and meet your needs because you're just SO goddamn special to them.

Besides, we all know this is going to happen come March:

http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/kotaku/2009/11/l4d2boycott.jpg

And this:

http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/kotaku/2009/11/1258035395841.jpg

Basically, gamers just jump on whatever bandwagon comes rolling outside their door.

Tai_MT
02-29-2012, 06:04 PM
"Bandwagon's full... please catch another."

fastNcurious
02-29-2012, 06:14 PM
Sometimes I hate being a gamer. The gaming community as a whole is full of whiny self-intitled babies. I laughed when people tried to boycott Left 4 Dead 2 and I'm still laughing now. Instead of boycotting why don't you get your point across by fasting? Because only then will EA sit up and meet your needs because you're just SO goddamn special to them.

I don't think it's limited to the gaming community. It's human nature. People will protest, organize, petition, etc., to express their opinion and hopefully try to exact change. A famous and recent example is the Occupy movement.

I don't have a problem with letting people express their opinions or trying to boycott/protest things. I think it shows courage to stand up for what you believe in, whether I agree or not.

I personally don't like all this DLC crap, but I know it's a way of business and it's not going away soon. I don't have the time or energy to do anything about it, so I don't mind if others protest on my behalf. :)

Lushasf
02-29-2012, 07:32 PM
The online pass is supposed to "stop used game sales", correct? Why does this need to happen? To quote those that defend it... "Because the game company doesn't get money from the used sale purchase". What? They don't? I'm sorry, that's pretty wrong there.

I buy a game. Buy it new. My money goes to the store and goes to the developers and everyone else. I decide I don't like the game. So, I sell it or turn it in for store credit (at a SEVERELY reduced price that the store will jack up later) which make it "used". Now someone else comes along and wants to buy it cheap, so they buy my "used" copy. How has the publisher lost anything? They already got the money from MY COPY of the game. Do they expect to make money from my copy TWICE? That seems a little fishy to me. I doubt a company "loses money" from the "used games" buying crowd. After all, every game that is bought "used" was once "new" and paid in full. They already got the money from that game that could've been made.

The issue isn't that the game company wants to get money from that one copy multiple times, the issue is loss of revenue overall. For example, if 5 people buy a game new and then sell it back to a retailer, 5 more people buy those copies used, play it, and sell it back again, then 4 people buy those used games and play them. All players loved the game and rate it highly on metacritic. The numbers are: 14 people have played the game and the reviews and score are very high. Those 14 people can't wait for a sequel. However, from the game company's prospective, the game sold 5 copies and isn't worth making a sequel for. Now add a few zero's to those numbers and you see the point. 140,000 people play the game and love it, but the game only sold 50,000 units. Critically high, but massive financial disaster. "Project $10" or "Online Pass" is the companies way of getting you to buy the game new, thus showing people actually want the content and desire more. High scores with low sales or online petitions won't cut it.

As for your statement that "online passes" are only there to prevent the companies from losing money on "shitty" games, this is just wrong. Game companies put passes and DLC codes as a hook to buy new. Used games and even Rentals are cutting into the industry. If you support a studio, publisher, franchise or individual, then you need to support them buy purchasing the game at full price (even if that price is a year later when the MSRP has lowered). If you don't care about the development side then yes, buy them used. Just don't get upset when the titles you love stop being made due to poor sales.

Personally I am just waiting for game companies to start using the old PC game method of including a "key" in each copy. Enter the "key" and the game is flagged for that console and only that console. I don't want this, I just see it as the next step.

I buy games new out of principle so this wouldn't really affect me. Just like I don't go to Gamestop out of principle. I have no issue with people who use Gamestop (a friend of mine only shops there), it's just not for me. If you wanna save money on games however, check out Amazon. Amazon Prime has served me well. No tax and free release date shipping with credit for pre-ordering games. I got the N7 edition for $40 after credit with no tax and it will be at my house when I get home from work on Tuesday.

As far as Mass Effect 3, I pre-ordered the N7 edition from amazon back in November so I could get the (as of then) unnamed character and mission. I think it is great that BW is offering it as day 1 DLC for everyone who didn't pre-order the N7 edition. As for all the other DLC (Art Book, Figures, Gamestop pre-order), none of it matters. The 2 weapons will (like all pre-order DLC) be available a month or so later for a few bucks and all the DLC from figures are booster packs for the multiplayer that I can get in game anyway.

The only issue I have with Mass Effect 3 is the same issue I had with Mass Effect 2, and that's the change to an ammo system instead of the overheating system in Mass Effect. Other than that, I can't wait to play this game.

Wicelow
03-01-2012, 01:54 AM
Boycott the game if you want, I'll play it thinking about you missing on a great game for lame reasons.

The game alone is 40+ hours according to reviews.
So for the price we pay, and seeing other games length, it's quite good.

You don't like day 1 DLC ? Don't buy it.
But that's not a reason to give up on the entire game... :wtf

And now that the community is bitching, they probably won't add any new achievements for the DLC I'll get because I'm giving some extra € to have a collector edition.
You know what ? I may start a topic to cry about it, too !! :biglaugh

Tai_MT
03-01-2012, 04:31 AM
The issue isn't that the game company wants to get money from that one copy multiple times, the issue is loss of revenue overall. For example, if 5 people buy a game new and then sell it back to a retailer, 5 more people buy those copies used, play it, and sell it back again, then 4 people buy those used games and play them. All players loved the game and rate it highly on metacritic. The numbers are: 14 people have played the game and the reviews and score are very high. Those 14 people can't wait for a sequel. However, from the game company's prospective, the game sold 5 copies and isn't worth making a sequel for. Now add a few zero's to those numbers and you see the point. 140,000 people play the game and love it, but the game only sold 50,000 units. Critically high, but massive financial disaster. "Project $10" or "Online Pass" is the companies way of getting you to buy the game new, thus showing people actually want the content and desire more. High scores with low sales or online petitions won't cut it.

As for your statement that "online passes" are only there to prevent the companies from losing money on "shitty" games, this is just wrong. Game companies put passes and DLC codes as a hook to buy new. Used games and even Rentals are cutting into the industry. If you support a studio, publisher, franchise or individual, then you need to support them buy purchasing the game at full price (even if that price is a year later when the MSRP has lowered). If you don't care about the development side then yes, buy them used. Just don't get upset when the titles you love stop being made due to poor sales.

Personally I am just waiting for game companies to start using the old PC game method of including a "key" in each copy. Enter the "key" and the game is flagged for that console and only that console. I don't want this, I just see it as the next step.

I buy games new out of principle so this wouldn't really affect me. Just like I don't go to Gamestop out of principle. I have no issue with people who use Gamestop (a friend of mine only shops there), it's just not for me. If you wanna save money on games however, check out Amazon. Amazon Prime has served me well. No tax and free release date shipping with credit for pre-ordering games. I got the N7 edition for $40 after credit with no tax and it will be at my house when I get home from work on Tuesday.

As far as Mass Effect 3, I pre-ordered the N7 edition from amazon back in November so I could get the (as of then) unnamed character and mission. I think it is great that BW is offering it as day 1 DLC for everyone who didn't pre-order the N7 edition. As for all the other DLC (Art Book, Figures, Gamestop pre-order), none of it matters. The 2 weapons will (like all pre-order DLC) be available a month or so later for a few bucks and all the DLC from figures are booster packs for the multiplayer that I can get in game anyway.

The only issue I have with Mass Effect 3 is the same issue I had with Mass Effect 2, and that's the change to an ammo system instead of the overheating system in Mass Effect. Other than that, I can't wait to play this game.

But all of your points about the Online passes and the "buying used" become moot if people enjoy your game enough to KEEP IT and NOT SELL IT.

You sell games you never intend to play again. For whatever reason. I doubt the numbers are as high as you think they are. Except for games that are pretty crappy.

I hold onto every game I purchased because I may want to play those games again in the future. And indeed, I often do.

I've never even bought a "used" game. Though some of the titles that I see people buying "used" are many of the SAME TITLES that are in discount bargain bins six to ten months after release.

I seriously doubt the "used game purchases" are as high as any company makes them out to be. Unless that game has zero replay, or it's pretty bad... You aren't going to see a lot of people "buying used".

And quite honestly...

The practice of "buying used" has been going on for a VERY VERY long time. Even RENTING games has been going on for a long time. It's only within the last TWO YEARS of the... what is it? 40 year old industry that they claim "it's a problem"? Hell, Ebay and Amazon and other websites have been around for over ten years. They're only JUST NOW seeing an issue with "buying used"? Really? I'm sorry, I can't believe that, and anyone who does has no concept of history.

If it REALLY IS for the reason they say it is (and I seriously doubt that, I'd bet dollars to doughnuts they simply gave that reason so it wouldn't garner as much bad PR as it would if they were honest about it)... Then why is it designed so that it not only hurts companies like Gamestop (a company I don't care about to begin with...) but also friends of the purchaser? I want to loan a game to my friend... Oops, I can't. Even if I own two copies of the game (and hey, I do own two copies of some games for letting three people play on XBL on their own TVs at my apartment) I can't let them use it. One pass per game. Okay. Well, if I have two copies of the game, and four friends with four systems whom aren't always over at the same time... Well, then THEY have to purchase the "online pass" just to play with me. And if person A uses my pass, but doesn't come over for a while... And person B wants to play the game with me too, they suddenly can't 'cause I already let someone else use the pass.

What about rentals as well? Or what about letting other people on your Xbox play the game? The "online pass" only registers to YOUR ACCOUNT. So nobody else can use the pass at all, not even on your system.

You see what I'm saying here? It's REALLY hard to believe they came up with the "online pass" to simply "recouperate costs". Why would anyone trying to solve such a SIMPLE problem come up with something so highly invasive? Simple. To get people to buy their games for ANY kind of functionality at all. Just wait, that'll be the next thing they try. Redeem your online pass to even be allowed access to the singleplayer portion.

I mean, it's honestly VERY simple to get people to buy your game, or at least spend money with your company when they bought it used... The system is ALREADY in place...

Ever hear of Downloadable Content? Regular updates to extend gameplay? What you download is linked to your account, and it's optional. Pay for it if you want it. Link some achievements to it to get more people to purchase it. Make it fun and interesting to make it worth the cost people pay for it.

Lesse... No "online pass" for games like Oblivion or Skyrim... I haven't seen any for anything by Valve either... Wonder why THAT is.. don't you?

Hell, the "Shivering Isles" expansion for Oblivion was WELL WORTH the price I paid for it. I'm sure they made a ton of money on that deal. I'm sure a lot of people held onto copies of Oblivion and Skyrim as well.

Do ya see what I'm saying yet? With only a handfull of companies engaging in the "online pass" BS, and other companies still doing VERY well WITHOUT it... it makes you wonder just how NECESSARY it is. Or even if it's DOING what they ADVERTISE IT to be doing.

You know how the DRM on PC games doesn't work and simply promotes the hacking, cracking, and running of the game? How it drives customers away from the products that have it? Drives them to the cracked copies with better features and less invasiveness?

Do ya think console games will get that way if the "online pass" remains as invasive as it currently is? If it becomes more widespread?

I can see it going that way. And I can see companies whining about it too. Whining about what they did to themselves.

How to do your marketing and moneymaking...

1. Without customers, you don't have cash.
2. Accomodate customers as much as possible without losing money. Treat them with respect and make anything to do with your company as painless as possible.
3. Customers are NOT the enemy, treating them as such will make them BE the enemy. Flipping someone off has the immediate response of having them return the favor, only much MUCH angrier.
4. Lying to your customers is a no-no. Be honest with them at all times. All lies get found out eventually, and nobody likes being lied to or having their trust betrayed.

The companies engaging in the "online pass" stuff don't really know these four rules. Nor do they care. And then they wonder why their games end up "used". Because nobody wants to deal with their products "long term".

fastNcurious
03-01-2012, 04:45 AM
But all of your points
....


I think this website needs to add an award for Largest Average Number of Words Per Post. ;)


/jk. love ya

Robobeast76
03-01-2012, 06:18 AM
This stuff is hilarious.

I've wasted more money on less than a lot of people here. Wait till you all grow up and have real commitments and a mortgage in the hundreds of thousands of dollars and kids. You blow money like no-ones business. God I've had bottles of wine over $400, so a glass of that is more than one game.

Australia is even worse - we are still paying over $100 for games that you pay $60 for in the US and our exchange rate is better than yours.

MASS DOMINATION
03-01-2012, 07:31 AM
@Tai_MT

The bottom line is that when people buy a game used for $54.99 as opposed to $59.99 new, 100% of the money goes to the store and they don't need to buy another copy from the publisher because they technically resold the game they already bought. Its only recently that this has been a huge issue. Gamestop offers all kinds of deals and promotions to trade in your games and buy used. Deals like trading in 3 games of at least $8 value and getting a brand new game free! That's a pretty big saving and lots of people do it.

People don't only trade in games they think are crappy. They trade in games they beat and don't plan on playing again. For example, I beat L.A.Noire, got all the achievements and enjoyed my time with it. I know I'm probably never gonna play it again so I can either let it sit on my shelf for eternity or I can trade it in and get back some money to buy another game.

Most games don't have endless replayability. Mass Effect, Bioshock, Dead Space, Assassin's Creed...They are all fantastic games and some of my favourite games on the 360. But once you've beaten them once or twice you have no reason to keep playing them. A DLC pack may serve as a reason to go back and play it but only for a few hours. This is why people trade in their games to Gamestop and try and make a few bucks off game that will never get played again.
Now Gamestop just bought a game from a customer at a faction of the cost instead of paying a premium price to the publisher.

Later a dude walks into Gamestop and sees Mass Effect selling for $60 new or $55 used. He looks at each copy of the game and the only difference he can find is that the used copy is cheaper than the new copy. So logically he buys the used copy. Gamestop makes money, the customer saves money and the people who took years to create the product get zip.

Because of this publishers are forced to think of a way to make something off their product. Even if its as little as $10. All of the games I mentioned above added unnecessary/arguably tacked-on multiplayer to the sequels in an effort to deter trade-ins and incorporate an online pass to used games in-exchange for a little $10 bill.

It seems fair to me. I hardly ever buy used games for several reasons. The biggest reason is because I want my money to the developer and not the retailer. The new online pass just motivates me even more to spend a few dollars extra and buy new copy rather than used.

Yaymez
03-01-2012, 12:31 PM
This is pretty much exactly why they want to kill the used games market.

Tai_MT
03-01-2012, 06:59 PM
@Tai_MT

The bottom line is that when people buy a game used for $54.99 as opposed to $59.99 new, 100% of the money goes to the store and they don't need to buy another copy from the publisher because they technically resold the game they already bought. Its only recently that this has been a huge issue. Gamestop offers all kinds of deals and promotions to trade in your games and buy used. Deals like trading in 3 games of at least $8 value and getting a brand new game free! That's a pretty big saving and lots of people do it.

People don't only trade in games they think are crappy. They trade in games they beat and don't plan on playing again. For example, I beat L.A.Noire, got all the achievements and enjoyed my time with it. I know I'm probably never gonna play it again so I can either let it sit on my shelf for eternity or I can trade it in and get back some money to buy another game.

Most games don't have endless replayability. Mass Effect, Bioshock, Dead Space, Assassin's Creed...They are all fantastic games and some of my favourite games on the 360. But once you've beaten them once or twice you have no reason to keep playing them. A DLC pack may serve as a reason to go back and play it but only for a few hours. This is why people trade in their games to Gamestop and try and make a few bucks off game that will never get played again.
Now Gamestop just bought a game from a customer at a faction of the cost instead of paying a premium price to the publisher.

Later a dude walks into Gamestop and sees Mass Effect selling for $60 new or $55 used. He looks at each copy of the game and the only difference he can find is that the used copy is cheaper than the new copy. So logically he buys the used copy. Gamestop makes money, the customer saves money and the people who took years to create the product get zip.

Because of this publishers are forced to think of a way to make something off their product. Even if its as little as $10. All of the games I mentioned above added unnecessary/arguably tacked-on multiplayer to the sequels in an effort to deter trade-ins and incorporate an online pass to used games in-exchange for a little $10 bill.

It seems fair to me. I hardly ever buy used games for several reasons. The biggest reason is because I want my money to the developer and not the retailer. The new online pass just motivates me even more to spend a few dollars extra and buy new copy rather than used.

You're also neglecting the difference in "what exactly a used game is". When you PURCHASE a used game, even from Gamestop (oh the horror stories I've heard...) you're taking a massive risk that the game won't work. Or that portions of it won't work. Businesses that sell used games are NOTORIOUS for not testing the copies they buy from consumers. Why? Who's going to call them on it? Nobody. You bought used. You took that chance. The original person sold the game for $8 as you say... They've lost nothing in reality.

But again...

You're trying to classify your personal experience as "the standard". Okay, you sell your used games. I don't. I have friends who don't. Unless they need money for bills or other things they shouldn't be doing...

Do I have games I haven't played in years? Yeah. Does it mean I NEVER want to play them again? No.

I grew up playing Super Mario Brothers on the NES. I haven't touched it in over 15 years. Does that mean I'd never play it again? Nope. I probably will and probably have. In fact, I played it on the 3DS just last week.

I didn't play Oblivion once I beat everything in it for almost three years. I broke it out four months before Skyrim and started tooling around in it and enjoying myself again.

Great games will NOT be traded in.

Tell me, would you ever trade in a copy of Chrono Trigger? I wouldn't. Not for a million dollars. Screw you, best game ever, I'm keeping it.

I doubt I'm alone in this line of thinking either.

You get a lot of "used game" sales from people who don't have jobs or who foolishly spend their money on things they don't need. Some of these people who turn in games are children, and they do it because mommy and daddy won't get them the next cool game to come out. This also isn't "the norm" in terms of who turns in their games, but it is frequent.

See, I'm having trouble getting through to you guys that it's basically a "hand me down" when you buy a used game. It's just companies like Gamestop have decided to try to cash in on that because there's a market for it.

And honestly, I can see how a game company could've done this MUCH BETTER than they have. Again, why do you need an online pass? YOU DON'T.

If you could sell the game back to the publisher for "store credit" as these companies do, they could effectively combat the market for "used games" without the intrusion. Perhaps the "store credit" for returning the game wouldn't go towards a NEW game... But perhaps some DLC. Perhaps giving out Microsoft Points in terms of value. I know, I know, they probably don't want to deal with a "used game" market and having to take back their copies... But every copy they take back and resell is a copy they DO NOT have to print onto a NEW DISC. This could probably save them money in the long run.

I am not and never have been in favor of "shutting down a market". I am more in favor of trying to COMPETE with that market instead of trying to run it out of business. Competition works out best for the consumer. Shutting companies down works out best for the companies doing the shutting down.

In short, there really is NO reason an "online pass" should ever exist. Anyone with two brain cells to rub together (oh look, I have two and I solved in in ten seconds flat) could figure out how to solve their "problem" which I'm sure doesn't actually cut into their industry as much as they say it does.

Do you think Ford gets any money when a consumer trades in their old truck to get a new one and then that dealership sells their old truck as a "used car"? I doubt it... Just sayin'... It's extremely common in the auto-industry, yet you don't see them being whiny babies about it. It's more common in THAT industry than it ever will be in the video game industry.

Food for thought?

MASS DOMINATION
03-02-2012, 12:06 PM
@Tai_MT

I'm not saying I'm all for trading in used games. I hardly ever trade in my games until I know I wont play it again and if the game turned out to be nothing special. I have over 20 games that I'm finished with but will never trade in because I loved the time I spent with them. Unfortunately most games aren't amazing and give me no reason to ever play them again. If I don't get rid of them somehow then my game collection will become way too big. People want to get rid of games they are done with. The average/casual gamer doesn't have a strong attachment to their games like you and I do. If they get offered a little money to put towards a new game they will gladly do it. That's a fact.

And buying games used doesn't come with much of a risk. You can always trade the game in for another copy if it doesn't work. Unlike buying a game new and being completely stuck if for the game stops working (unless you pay $3 extra to add a warranty). Used games are always refurbished to make sure they work properly and in my personal experience I can only remember one time I bought a used game that didn't work well and it was easy to get a different copy.

When you buy a used car you can't choose all the cool features you want as if you were buying new. The car also doesn't look quite as nice and has worn-in parts and mileage. Game discs either perform or they don't. There is no in-between. When playing a game nothing separates a used disc from a new disc. Most people don't care if the game case wasn't sealed and the new game smell is gone. They care about the game itself and without an 'online pass', the consumer has no reason to pay more when they can pay less.

We can argue all day about whether the season pass is the best way publishers should go about combating the used game market, but the one thing we know for sure is that used games take away a huge chunk of revenue from the people who deserve it most. Because of that, I have no issue with them finding ways to make little money back. Especially when its hardly affects me.