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OxygenJunkie
06-22-2012, 04:37 PM
Now don't get me wrong here, I appreciate all the hard work and effort that everyone puts into making guides here. I've been using this website and forum for as long as I can remember and it has helped me enormously.

Just one thing tho....anyone feel that some roadmaps aren't actually roadmaps anymore?

My idea of a roadmap is something like :

Level X

You will get Y achievement for completing this level
Achievement Z and Q can also be attained in this level by doing such and such
Also look out for 6 collectibles towards Achievement P

Level R
You can get.....

and so on.

You know what I mean? A lot of roadmaps I'm coming across are a list of achievements and how to obtain them with no chronological order. Whilst still extremely helpful they are a lot harder to keep track off.

Again, not complaining, just throwing this out there....

Wildmn34
06-22-2012, 05:01 PM
It all depends on who's writing them. I much prefer chronological listed achievements for something like a road map. So, I'll agree with you there.

Tsaako
06-22-2012, 05:03 PM
I actually don't have a problem with how the current road maps are layed out. I find it more concerning that theres still roap maps to be added even with people making them with achievement guides. (MW3 and WWE 12).

Wish things can be brought up to scratch.

bigbear2face
06-22-2012, 05:23 PM
Wish things can be brought up to scratch.

The mods have enough to worry about. I'd rather them fix the current issues with the spam bots (it's getting worse!) and with GTs not showing up properly.

Gackt
06-22-2012, 05:24 PM
Now don't get me wrong here, I appreciate all the hard work and effort that everyone puts into making guides here. I've been using this website and forum for as long as I can remember and it has helped me enormously.

Just one thing tho....anyone feel that some roadmaps aren't actually roadmaps anymore?

My idea of a roadmaps is something like :

Level X

You will get Y achievement for completing this level
Achievement Z and Q can also be attained in this level by doing such and such
Also look out for 6 collectibles towards Achievement P

Level R
You can get.....

and so on.

You know what I mean? A lot of roadmaps I'm coming across are a list of achievements and how to obtain them with no chronological order. Whilst still extremely helpful they are a lot harder to keep track off.

Again, not complaining, just throwing this out there....

I agree. To many roadmaps don't have any order to them like they should.

AmbaLaBamba
06-22-2012, 05:28 PM
I do agree yes, some roadmaps aren't even roadmaps. There are a handful on here though that I've used in the past (can't remember them off the top of my head) and they did show what achievements could be earned and in what order.

mrj3d
06-22-2012, 05:35 PM
Yeah, agreed. When done right, roadmaps are extremely helpful. I always look at them first when starting a new game to discover the best way to approach the game.

xKRAIZEEMANx
06-22-2012, 05:42 PM
I agree with you OP, when done properly, a road-map is an invaluable tool. Though I have gotten accustomed to scrolling up and down, "plotting" out a level to a game.
I do greatly appreciate anyone who takes the time do something even remotely resembling a road-map. But a chronologically detailed road-map is "hands-down" the best (IMO).

DragonsGoMOO
06-22-2012, 06:47 PM
I need the roadmap, that tells me how difficult the game is, how many online/offline achievements there are, glitched achievements, missable, and all that good stuff.

If it doesn't have it, I don't bother looking at the guide. That's the one crucial thing it needs. If it doesn't have what I listed above, it's pointless to me. If you're already making the guide, just spend the extra time to put that shit in. Stop being lazy.

SilentStrike011
06-22-2012, 09:34 PM
The mods have enough to worry about. I'd rather them fix the current issues with the spam bots (it's getting worse!) and with GTs not showing up properly.

This. The spambots this last couple of weeks have been ridiculous.

Neverender
06-22-2012, 09:40 PM
In the guide team we try to ensure the quality of all of the guides that are posted to the main site. If there are a few that are particularly bad, you can let us know by posting here (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/showthread.php?t=293981). Or you can PM me if you'd prefer.

Anyway, yes, roadmaps that are chronologically ordered are generally the most helpful. There are also roadmaps that say "complete this mode, move on to this mode" that are quite helpful as well. Most of the time road maps don't list the individual achievements earned because it would make the roadmap into a formatted hell. While yes, it would be helpful, there's just no way to do it and not scare people with the formatting. In the guide team we've realized that and it seems like the submitters have, too.

HugTheBear
06-22-2012, 09:55 PM
I agree. To many roadmaps don't have any order to them like they should.

Agreed. Some people make them with great order. Others are kind of all over the place. Depends on who does the roadmap, I guess.

I'm with the OP on this one. I'd like to see more order in the guides. I haven't made one, so I can't really complain.

EliteShadowMan
06-22-2012, 10:40 PM
2 out of my 4 guides have been in chronological order. I've started doing them that way since it's easier to write, and for people to follow. I just hate how most guides use videos for 1/2 of the achievements. If you can't explain how to do an achievement, then you shouldn't write a guide.

dakisbac
06-22-2012, 10:44 PM
To be honest I can't really recall seeing any roadmaps that aren't in chronological order or ordered by game mode so if there are a "lot" of them then please list them for us. If I saw any like this I would definitely not post them.

At least as far as I'm concerned roadmaps are held to higher standards than guides. There have been many times where I've added the guide but not the roadmap. That said, the people submitting apparently have the opposite view and I've seen some really sloppy roadmaps.

2 out of my 4 guides have been in chronological order. I've started doing them that way since it's easier to write, and for people to follow. I just hate how most guides use videos for 1/2 of the achievements. If you can't explain how to do an achievement, then you shouldn't write a guide.

I agree. I really tend to avoid looking at guides where it's mostly videos because I don't want to watch them. They are great as supplemental material but if you're posting only a video (and worse, someone else's video) then you really don't deserve credit for the guide. x360a could steal guides from YT and post them on here without your help.

OxygenJunkie
06-22-2012, 10:44 PM
In the guide team we try to ensure the quality of all of the guides that are posted to the main site. If there are a few that are particularly bad, you can let us know by posting here (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/showthread.php?t=293981). Or you can PM me if you'd prefer.

Anyway, yes, roadmaps that are chronologically ordered are generally the most helpful. There are also roadmaps that say "complete this mode, move on to this mode" that are quite helpful as well. Most of the time road maps don't list the individual achievements earned because it would make the roadmap into a formatted hell. While yes, it would be helpful, there's just no way to do it and not scare people with the formatting. In the guide team we've realized that and it seems like the submitters have, too.

Something as simple as a level list and the names of which achievements can be obtained in said level at the bottom of every guide would go a far way in my opinion.

Just listing achievements and how to get them (in my opinion) is not a roadmap. I like to think of going through a game getting achievements as like driving a car and using a literal road map. You will be going from point A to point B, and stopping at all the necessary gas stations and supermarkets e.t.c for supplies, following the map. Whereas if you just had a list of all the places you needed to visit, in no particular order, you would waste a lot of time trying to figure out which stop is next and eventually miss a few and will have to go out your way to visit them.

PS. Yes, yes I am high.

Neverender
06-22-2012, 11:13 PM
Something as simple as a level list and the names of which achievements can be obtained in said level at the bottom of every guide would go a far way in my opinion.
It's a good idea, but to retroactivate (that may not be a real word, but you get the point) every roadmap on the site would require a massive workforce and a lot of time, neither of which the guide team has at the moment.

Just listing achievements and how to get them (in my opinion) is not a roadmap. I like to think of going through a game getting achievements as like driving a car and using a literal road map. You will be going from point A to point B, and stopping at all the necessary gas stations and supermarkets e.t.c for supplies, following the map. Whereas if you just had a list of all the places you needed to visit, in no particular order, you would waste a lot of time trying to figure out which stop is next and eventually miss a few and will have to go out your way to visit them.
Listing achievements and how to get them is a guide. If the roadmap seems too much like the guide, I publish the guide to the main site but not the roadmap. Yes, there are roadmaps of varying quality on the site and I agree on your view of which are best.

We spend most of our time adding new guides/roadmaps to the site, though. Occasionally a bad one slips through. Blame it on poor judgement, sleep deprivation, or whatever, but it happens occasionally. When it does, we're usually unaware, but that's what this thread (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/showthread.php?t=293981) is for.

At least as far as I'm concerned roadmaps are held to higher standards than guides. There have been many times where I've added the guide but not the roadmap. That said, the people submitting apparently have the opposite view and I've seen some really sloppy roadmaps.
I agree. I've rejected a lot more roadmaps than I have guides and I've published guides without roadmaps because of poor quality. There have been some good guides with some terrible road maps...

I agree. I really tend to avoid looking at guides where it's mostly videos because I don't want to watch them. They are great as supplemental material but if you're posting only a video (and worse, someone else's video) then you really don't deserve credit for the guide. x360a could steal guides from YT and post them on here without your help.
Processing guides with videos sucks. I'd always prefer a text-based guide. I know some things are hard to explain and require a video, but when 90% of a guide is composed of videos it's a pain in the ass and it's just not as high of quality as it could be. Plus, the lag from 20 videos is enough to make my computer attempt suicide on a regular basis.

Onelastbreath
06-23-2012, 11:30 AM
I firstly have to say thanks to all the guys out there that write the roadmaps. They make life much easier on so many games.

Some are defo better than others, like others have said chronological order achievement road maps are awesome but very thin on the ground. Tbh though even when there not it only takes a little extra reading and planning to get the most out of your playthroughs :woop: