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The Pants Party
11-05-2007, 01:09 AM
Well, somewhat selfishly, I'd like to see some feedback on the three reviews posted today. In case you didn't put two and two together, I wrote them all. :p

In an effort to become a better writer for my future reviews, let me know what you thought of them.

I have reviews finished for Rayman Raving Rabbids, Phantasy Star Universe, Shrek the Third and Beautiful Katamari ready to be posted, so watch out for those later in the week. :D

------------------
All Pro Football 2K8 (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=269)
Eternal Sonata (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=253)
Halo 3 (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=274)

Webb
11-05-2007, 01:12 AM
Just as an FYI as well. We're hoping to implement a comments system on th reviews somewhere down the line ;)

Marx0r
11-05-2007, 01:22 AM
I like the knowledge you put into your reviews. The Eternal Sonata review in particular showed a pretty in-depth knowledge of the entire genre. I would like to see the Halo player with 5000 EXP and 10 skill though. :p All in all, those are some of the better reviews I've seen on the internet. I could definitely see me basing my purchases off them if I didn't already have Halo, despise RPGs, and plan to rent All Pro.

Maka
11-05-2007, 01:46 AM
I have yet to read them through, just a simple skim thus far.

But my biggest problem is that the "Overall" score is an average of the 5 categories. I dont think it should be done this way, because it skews the real mark of a game. A game can have bad graphics, and plain audio, with lack-luster achievements, and still be great fun, and deserves an 80, when in theory it will only get a 65-70. Works the other way as well. A game can have great graphics, awesome achievements, but it just istn fun to play.

I think the overall score should, instead, be a mark given to the game by the reviewer, separately from the other grades.

Webb
11-05-2007, 01:52 AM
They are separate. But you will find that a lot of the time, the average scores are the same as the final score, thats just how it works out.

The Pants Party
11-05-2007, 02:56 AM
One extra thing here... please don't respond if you're just going to bash the score I gave something, I'm just trying to get some feedback on the content and writing style.

I have already received one ignorant PM because someone thought my Eternal Sonata review was too generous. If there's one thing I'm not, it is subjective in my reviewing. If the game was crap, I'd admit it. (See my review of Fantastic Four, for instance.)

Reviewing is supposed to reflect what the reviewer feels about the game, not what he thinks the public might feel about the game. I know for a fact people don't normally like Japanese RPGs, but I'm not writing the review to appease their feelings, I'm writing to reflect my experience with the game. If the things I like sound lame to you, then don't get the game. If they sound cool, then do. Or at least rent it and give it a try, anyway.

Alright, rant over, that PM just caught me off guard.

Birky
11-05-2007, 03:27 AM
Wow I must say very good. I honestly felt like I was reading Game Informer. I think that it was very professional and you did a great job. I only read the Halo review because I don't like RPG's or sports games.

You may not take it as much of a compliment from a 16 year old but I really did enjoy reading the review. I am in 'Honors Collage Writing Lab' and at my school that's something that kids really try to get into. There is a limit of the number of kids in it and you must take a test before applying for the class to see if you are, well smart enough. I am just saying that so that you know I know what I am talking about. I have analyzed many famous works of literature, popular newspapers, magazines, and poems. I'm not going to say that your review is as good as those, because obviously it is not. But I will say that it was well written. I found no grammar or spelling errors and you carefully worded everything.

I enjoy reading very much but it is often taken away by my love for video games. It is VERY hard to find well written game information, reviews, and info that is not biased. I enjoy reading about video games since I like to play them so much but often run into articles basically saying this game sucks, or this game is epic your a noob if you don't love it. While reading your review I felt like I was being informed about he game not told what to think about the game. This is the only review from the x360a team I have read so far but I am most definitely planing on reading older ones for games I have played.

I know that this is kind of a lengthy reply but my main message is basically that you are a very talented writer and I hope that you keep coming with good reviews as I enjoyed it so much. It also appeals to me to perhaps write a review for a game for the site.

That is all I have to say for now, great job and good luck on future reviews!

Fonkey Monkey
11-05-2007, 03:44 AM
i disagree with the scores on halo 3 and all pro, but man those are some incredible reviews. nice work man, you got skillz.

The Pants Party
11-06-2007, 01:56 PM
Well, less of a response than I'd hoped, but thanks for the good words, guys. Wouldn't be good to keep reviewing the same way if no one liked it. :0

fatces
11-06-2007, 04:25 PM
i just read your eternal sonata review and i think it was great. i actually finished the game and got the full 1000, so i was aware of all the things that you said and you actually tranlate them very well to paper. just a minor gripe pants, actually it's something that didn't bother me (since i already played it) , on your review intro, in an effort of explaining what's the game about i think you put to much (polka living in tenuto and selling floral powder, etc), since that's part of the history of the game; otherwise congrats pants your an excellent writer and hope to see more of your reviews soon ;)

Mr Arrow
11-06-2007, 04:32 PM
The review are all great, although I may not agree with all the scoring, the time and effort you put in is second to none. Your dedication to this site is admirable, not just with the reviews but with keeping the forums clean and idiot free.

You are a great asset to this site, hope that powers that be are fully aware.


BTW - It did not go unnoticed that you did ALL the reviews this time.

Webb
11-06-2007, 05:30 PM
BTW - It did not go unnoticed that you did ALL the reviews this time.

Wait for the next batch :p lol

The Pants Party
11-06-2007, 05:40 PM
Hehe, yeah, next batch is yet another FOUR that I have done, though three of them are about 3-4 months old. :eek:

Bulletman
11-06-2007, 05:48 PM
Yo pants! Im playing Eternal Sonata at the moment and thought your review does it complete justice Its nice to know when someone feels the same way about a game that you love yourself so much. The other thing is its obvious that you like the game but you wrote the review in an accesable way so that people that might not like RPGs would probably give this game a go, so well done mate:)

Cyrex
11-06-2007, 05:57 PM
while i have suggested this earlier. you need to create a way to compare up to 4 different games reviews so you can compare Blue Dragon to Eternal Sonata to Phantasy Star Universe (i know the review has yet to be done) the point is that you should be able to compare games to each other to see if they are better than the others


also update the list of people on the review team because at the moment it looks like the only person working on reviews is Pants Party

Webb
11-06-2007, 06:09 PM
Pants has some that have been floating around for a while. We're really trying to push them out this week. graf1k has a few that lack the final touches and there are reviews being edited as we speak. It just so happens that Pants have all come at once :D

And as I said on the front page, we are looking at recruiting so expect more reviews (amazing of course ;)) from some fresh faces over the next few months.

graf1k
11-06-2007, 11:37 PM
graf1k has a few that lack the final touches and there are reviews being edited as we speak.

I do? I thought I got all my old ones out the door before I took my break. Weird....

The Pants Party
11-06-2007, 11:42 PM
I do? I thought I got all my old ones out the door before I took my break. Weird....

Blazing Angels, Far Cry and Saint's Row are sitting in the submissions section with only "wank, wank, wank" as the text body. That might be the hold-up. Just a guess though. :)

Webb
11-06-2007, 11:43 PM
lol I've read them but you took them away to touch up :p

killlah631
11-07-2007, 02:14 AM
I really like how in-depth you're reviews are, and I actually did read all 3 of the reviews recently put up for AP2K8, Halo, and Eternal Sonata. You really look into all the aspects of the game, great writing techniques. I'm not sure if it's already into effect but I briefly saw what Maka said awhile ago about the overall score being average, which I don't think is good as that average is non-resistant to it's bad points which can skew it's overall down a lot or the up a lot. Thanks for all the reviews you've been putting out though, got me to buy Eternal Sonata yesterday!

graf1k
11-07-2007, 06:43 PM
Blazing Angels, Far Cry and Saint's Row are sitting in the submissions section with only "wank, wank, wank" as the text body. That might be the hold-up. Just a guess though. :)

Actually, that IS the review. ZING!

The Pants Party
11-07-2007, 07:29 PM
Wouldn't surprise me with those games.

The Pants Party
11-13-2007, 05:48 PM
Four more reviews posted today. Once again, all from me. :D

PSU, Rayman and Shrek were all some of the first reviews I did, so they aren't as good as Katamari or the other ones posted last week.

Beautiful Katamari (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=327)
Phantasy Star Universe (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=123)
Rayman Raving Rabbids (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=211)
Shrek The Third (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=232)

Shinobi273
11-13-2007, 05:58 PM
Four more reviews posted today. Once again, all from me. :D

I think the reviews are great, but you always bring it back to all the reviews were written by you. Who else can write reviews? I still like the quality and depth of your reviews, and the timeliness is getting better too.

Webb
11-13-2007, 06:05 PM
I think the reviews are great, but you always bring it back to all the reviews were written by you. Who else can write reviews? I still like the quality and depth of your reviews, and the timeliness is getting better too.

Everyone does. It just so happens that Pants had some waiting to get added for one reason or another. Don't worry, they aren't all Pants, he's just had a busy month :p

ClutchPapi34
11-13-2007, 09:49 PM
I think that they are written very well. I enjoyed reading the halo 3 review. It would have made me buy it if I didn't already own it. :)

highpass
11-13-2007, 09:54 PM
It would have made me buy it if I didn't already own it. :)

We were hoping it was so good you'd go out and buy an extra copy. In this regard, we have failed.

We could do with a little bit of text to the effect of "Overall score is not an average of the above" just to save confusion.

Auroni
11-13-2007, 11:01 PM
I don't understand how Rayman's achievements scores are so high. Especially for a game that has glitched achievements.

The Pants Party
11-13-2007, 11:10 PM
Well, you can get 650 in it after only a few hours which is why I have it a 65. There are also no glitched achievements. Everyone thinks it is glitched, but you simply need a perfect score in every single mini-game, which takes a ridiculous amount of skill and has not been done yet. It is technically possible, but highly improbable.

Bluntman428
11-16-2007, 08:09 PM
I think the reviews are great, but you always bring it back to all the reviews were written by you. Who else can write reviews? I still like the quality and depth of your reviews, and the timeliness is getting better too.


I think that says it all right there.

graf1k and Davey Pitch write some badass reviews.

The Pants Party
11-17-2007, 12:25 AM
Call of Duty 4 (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/review.php?gameID=377)

Single Player by newcomer Saiox2 and Multiplayer by the Blunt.

PerpetualHeaven
11-17-2007, 08:22 PM
I'm extremely surprised with the Hour of Victory score. The average metacritic rating was 38 and 60 was actually the highest. I have to disagree with it being similar in terms of graphics with COD2. The Two Worlds review was pretty darn shocking too. Never really played it, but I never heard it was so bad that it was called the worst.

Webb
11-17-2007, 08:29 PM
Ohhhhh, it's got as low as 20 by sites like Gamespy ;)

Blunt asked us whether we had anything positive we could add to up the score and everyone was silent lol So I have no qualms with that score whatsoever. The game was obviously rushed and incomplete.

KINGxSAINT
11-17-2007, 10:08 PM
Horrible review this games i 8/10 mine never has to stop and load.

Bluntman428
11-17-2007, 10:12 PM
I've stated my opinion on Two Worlds in many threads before this one.

Like Webb said, I asked the review team if they had anything positive to say about it, and no one had anything to say about it.

Two Worlds is an uninspired, terribly boring, incredibly bugged hunk of shit. Simple as that. Yes, some people may enjoy it, but some people enjoy Bomberman Act Zero and Pimp My Ride too. I personally love the genre, but I don't rate games on their genre. I rate them based on how they stack up against games of all genres.

Two Worlds has literally countless bugs, a framerate that stutters all the time to the point where I thought my game had froze up when it came to a dead stop for 30+ seconds, a terrible story and pathetic voice acting (two things that are absolutely vital in an RPG), and the story itself only takes roughly 10-15 hours to complete which is terrible for an RPG. There are no redeeming qualities about the game, absolutely none. Even if you look past the technical flaws, it still has horrid graphics, dull and repetitive gameplay, and no innovative features whatsoever.

As far as Hour of Victory goes, I agree the score should be much lower, but scores are given out by individuals with their own opinions. If the reviewer gave it a 60, that's his score and how he feels about it. If you don't like it, there's other reviews out there with other opinions. I personally read several reviews when I'm trying to make up my mind about a particular game.

The Pants Party
11-17-2007, 10:30 PM
Horrible review this games i 8/10 mine never has to stop and load.

What game are you even referring to?

Webb
11-17-2007, 10:36 PM
What game are you even referring to?

Two Worlds, cause he spammed the exact same post in a thread in the Two Worlds forum... Yet he has still been able to back up his argument with absolutely ANYTHING.

Bluntman428
11-17-2007, 10:41 PM
It's okay, he's entitled to his opinion, as illiterate as he may be.

Some people don't mind getting robbed by developers who release unfinished trash. Personally, I still want my $60 back.

Tussell
11-17-2007, 11:33 PM
I really like the Tenchu Z one.

Bax x360a
11-18-2007, 01:05 AM
I'm extremely surprised with the Hour of Victory score. The average metacritic rating was 38 and 60 was actually the highest. I have to disagree with it being similar in terms of graphics with COD2. The Two Worlds review was pretty darn shocking too. Never really played it, but I never heard it was so bad that it was called the worst.
I actually quite enjoyed Hour of Victory, it's far better than the demo. How did you find the review, a good read I hope?

Bax x360a
11-18-2007, 01:12 AM
I really like the Tenchu Z one.
I thought that one kinda sucked :p

Xterm1n8or
11-18-2007, 01:17 AM
I really liked the Hour of Victory review! I thought the score was ok and because of the fantastically written review, very detailed, with everything i want to know about the game, i may just go out and buy it, or rent it!

Sanction
11-18-2007, 01:24 AM
Shouldn't Hour of Victory get a 70? It got three 70's, one 60 and an 80...but somehow got rated as a 60...was this a mistake or am I retarded?

Xterm1n8or
11-18-2007, 01:25 AM
Shouldn't Hour of Victory get a 70? It got three 70's, one 60 and an 80...but somehow got rated as a 60...was this a mistake or am I retarded?

I think Webb commented on this somewhere i read a few days ago. Apparently the overall rating is at the reviewers discretion and isnt actually an average, i may be wrong though..

Sanction
11-18-2007, 01:27 AM
They are separate. But you will find that a lot of the time, the average scores are the same as the final score, thats just how it works out.

Yep...there it is...guess HoV is one of the games where it is a bit different.

The Pants Party
11-18-2007, 01:49 AM
Yeah, most of the time the achievement score (or just one section in general) can skew a final score too high or low, so we just give the thing a general overall score as opposed to a straight average of the other scores.

Tussell
11-18-2007, 02:04 AM
I thought that one kinda sucked :p
You crack me up. :P

PerpetualHeaven
11-18-2007, 03:07 AM
I actually quite enjoyed Hour of Victory, it's far better than the demo. How did you find the review, a good read I hope?

Yes, I actually enjoyed it a lot. I like your writing style and look forward to reading your other ones. Can't say I agree with the scores, but of course your review, your score :p

As for Two Worlds, I haven't played it so I can't really expand on that much. But, it's his review so I can't say he's wrong and no one can. You can see the frustrations through the writing though as your other reviews aren't similar in style. You must have really hated it. Either way though, it was pretty good read. I said I was shocked by the ratings, and that's only because I didn't know if it was actually THAT bad.

Either way, enjoyed this batch of reviews. Excellent job newcomers and keep up the good work Blunt.

Tussell
11-18-2007, 05:44 AM
Thanks to the warm welcome to the team. Look forward to stickin' to it.

Bax x360a
11-18-2007, 01:38 PM
Yes, I actually enjoyed it a lot. I like your writing style and look forward to reading your other ones. Can't say I agree with the scores, but of course your review, your score :p
Just out of curiosty, what would you have given the Hour of Victory scores?

PerpetualHeaven
11-18-2007, 02:26 PM
Just out of curiosty, what would you have given the Hour of Victory scores?

Can't really say since I haven't gotten it but I don't think the COD2 graphics were similar. Only because the shine in Hour of Victory was so high that the character models looked a lot like my GI Joe action figurine. I would have rated the graphics lower. Only thing I can really base off of the demo. I particularly didn't like how you had to have certain characters to go into specific areas. But don't worry about it. It's your review, you can't always please everyone. All that matters is you're writing quality reviews and I give you big kudos for that.

mrhobo
11-18-2007, 02:43 PM
i utterly disagree with you on two of the reviews.
Two Worlds - You gave visuals a 30? i thought the graphics where great. go up to one of the dragons and tell me that has worse grpahics then a xbla game. there not better then every game but definetely better then 80% of them. I have no idea why you gave Playability a 10. This is the one game besides Halo I could play over and over again. I was so happy when this came out with oblivion being the last rpg like that i could recall. the audio wasnt bad but with the people talking it looks like a japanese movie. Forsooth!
At first it seems like a bad game but it grows on you.
Tenchu Z- This game was fun but at then end it got HORRIBLle. the first one or two play throughs its extremely fun but after 4 you just want to break the disc. The online co-op was just amazing so much fun competeing against my friends for kills.
I would like to see a review on Bladestorm: The Hundred Years War. Im addicted to this game and would want to know what other people think of it.

Honkymagoo
11-18-2007, 04:25 PM
I just flat-out disagree with Two Worlds getting a 24. I realize the game was love it or hate it but I thought it was fantastic. I understand that it is your review on the game but it seems to be quite biased and unknowledgeable on some aspects of the game.

I don't understand how you can make fun of a game for using "Old English" as you call it. The way they speak is relevant in the time setting. Not to mention you obviously don't know what "Old English" is. Old English was spoken before the 12th Century. Example:http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/08/Beowulf.firstpage.jpeg

It isn't even Middle English used in the game. Middle English evolved from Old English after the 12th Century. Example of Middle English:

"Syan ws geworden t he ferde urh a ceastre and t castel: godes rice prediciende and bodiende. and hi twelfe mid. And sume wif e wron gehlede of awyrgdum gastum: and untrumnessum: seo magdalenisce maria ofre seofan deoflu uteodon: and iohanna chuzan wif herodes gerefan: and susanna and manega ore e him of hyra spedum enedon."

They speak in "Early Modern English" which was spoken in the time of Shakespeare. If you've ever read/seen a Shakespeare play you'd obviously recognize the language in Two Worlds. As a big Shakespeare fan I loved the fact that they used this dialect in the game. As for the corny voice acting I thought it made it even more enjoyable. I feel as though they may have done it on purpose for shits and giggles. It made me laugh and I couldn't get enough.

The game started off slow and took some getting used to. Sure the frame rate was choppy but if you simply turned off grass effects it improved the rates considerably. After 30 minutes the game became out of control fun. There were tons of side quests which were always quite different. Unlike games like WoW where every quest is just collecting so many of a certain item I thought this game did a great job with original quests. Not to mention the tons of different weapons/gear that you could find and stack for improved equipment.

Bax x360a
11-18-2007, 04:31 PM
I'm loving all the feedback and everybodies reviews of the reviews :p People have got to realise that a review is a person's opinion of a game; people are always going to have different opinions about something. Personally, I completely agree with the Two Worlds review, absolutely shocking game to me.

Webb
11-18-2007, 04:32 PM
The game started off slow and took some getting used to. Sure the frame rate was choppy but if you simply turned off grass effects it improved the rates considerably.

You should NEVER have to do that with a console game. That is unacceptable in my eyes.

mrhobo
11-18-2007, 08:45 PM
your unacceptable
originial, I know

but to me the game just got 10x better at the later part. having to invade the dark towers and finally the orc base. love it love it love it
not to mention the best spell and mount system ever

and why is it not acceptable? If it was just more generic more "acceptable" it wouldve gotten even lower scores. they tried to make a new control system and i think they got it head on

The Pants Party
11-18-2007, 10:21 PM
Blacksite: Area 51 (by me)
(http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=318)
John Woo Presents Stranglehold (by Davey Pitch)
(http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=302)

Bluntman428
11-19-2007, 12:04 AM
I just flat-out disagree with Two Worlds getting a 24. I realize the game was love it or hate it but I thought it was fantastic. I understand that it is your review on the game but it seems to be quite biased and unknowledgeable on some aspects of the game.

Trust me, I know more about Two Worlds than I'd like. I didn't play it for 5 minutes and then sit down and write a review for it. I got 845 gamerpoints in it, so I definitely took the time to play it before I wrote the review.

Old English is the general term people use to describe that dialect. I'm aware there's different time periods and different dialects, but that's still the term used most often. I didn't care enough to research what bloody dialect the developers used, because it's inconsequential. The voice acting and script sucked, that's all that matters.

For the record, Two Worlds got a 4 and a 2 in Game Informer, so I'm not the only one who hated it. As said before, some people just like bad games. But I wasn't going to give a horrendously bugged and uninspired game a score it didn't deserve. It's not like the bugs were obscure or the framerate was choppy at some points. The devs released the game knowing it had those problems, giving a big F you to anyone who was looking forward to it. The game deserves the score, and that's that.

pongsifu
11-19-2007, 12:26 AM
I've seen a lot of reviews by you pants party because you are staff, but are the other people staff members? Or do random people submit reviews and you guys pick the ones that don't suck?

highpass
11-19-2007, 12:37 AM
Some of the members submitting reviews just happen to be staff. We've had many "test" submissions from members and based on their work, decide whether or not to offer them a place on the team (making them staff in a sense anyway).

Bluntman428
11-19-2007, 01:04 AM
I've seen a lot of reviews by you pants party because you are staff, but are the other people staff members? Or do random people submit reviews and you guys pick the ones that don't suck?

Pants was a reviewer before he was Staff actually. :p

Like highpass said, reviewers are picked based on submissions. If the writer has potential, we put them on on a trial basis. From there, me and the other editors work with them and see if they'll make the cut. Anyone can be a reviewer if they can write interesting reviews. All it takes is a sample review sent to us, and once we get it we look it over and make a decision on it.

It's more work than it seems. People on the review team spend hours writing these reviews, often playing through crappy games and spending their own money solely to provide ya'll with quality reviews. A good review can take 5-10 hours to write and finish, and from there you've got to go through the editing and coding process. It's a lot of work, and everyone on the team has a high level of commitment to the site and the community here.

Honkymagoo
11-19-2007, 01:07 AM
Trust me, I know more about Two Worlds than I'd like. I didn't play it for 5 minutes and then sit down and write a review for it. I got 845 gamerpoints in it, so I definitely took the time to play it before I wrote the review.

Old English is the general term people use to describe that dialect. I'm aware there's different time periods and different dialects, but that's still the term used most often. I didn't care enough to research what bloody dialect the developers used, because it's inconsequential. The voice acting and script sucked, that's all that matters.

For the record, Two Worlds got a 4 and a 2 in Game Informer, so I'm not the only one who hated it. As said before, some people just like bad games. But I wasn't going to give a horrendously bugged and uninspired game a score it didn't deserve. It's not like the bugs were obscure or the framerate was choppy at some points. The devs released the game knowing it had those problems, giving a big F you to anyone who was looking forward to it. The game deserves the score, and that's that.

I'm not saying that you can't hate it. I know a lot of people didn't like it and I think that's their loss. My whole point about the English was for professionalism. Just because people use the term that doesn't make it right. I'll level with you and say that your average person doesn't know the difference between Old English and Early Modern English. But your occasional reader is going to have paid attention in English class and know the difference. Perhaps they will disregard your entire review based on thinking you don't know what you're talking about. All I'm saying is 5 minutes of google searching could make a review 10x better.

pongsifu
11-19-2007, 01:19 AM
Pants was a reviewer before he was Staff actually. :p

Like highpass said, reviewers are picked based on submissions. If the writer has potential, we put them on on a trial basis. From there, me and the other editors work with them and see if they'll make the cut. Anyone can be a reviewer if they can write interesting reviews. All it takes is a sample review sent to us, and once we get it we look it over and make a decision on it.

It's more work than it seems. People on the review team spend hours writing these reviews, often playing through crappy games and spending their own money solely to provide ya'll with quality reviews. A good review can take 5-10 hours to write and finish, and from there you've got to go through the editing and coding process. It's a lot of work, and everyone on the team has a high level of commitment to the site and the community here.

Heh, I don't think I could write a review, I'm a perfectionist so it would probably take me twice as long :P

Blackjaw x
11-19-2007, 01:44 AM
Awh, I'm disappointed with the Blacksite review.
Pants, I thought you'd give it better since you were doing pretty well in multiplayer.
I think it should have got more points because of the multiplayer, and I also think the graphics in general are great.. much better than some other games which got higher scores.
This game is definitely one that has to grow on you, and after three days of playing it, it's become my favourite 360 game to date.

It's also 48 dossiers, just count the list...

LegendBoy
11-19-2007, 02:11 AM
I've got a Perfect Dark Zero review which should be submitted hopefully in the next week. Hope its up to the high standards set here, all the reviews I've read are excellent!

Webb
11-19-2007, 02:20 AM
I've got a Perfect Dark Zero review which should be submitted hopefully in the next week. Hope its up to the high standards set here, all the reviews I've read are excellent!

I look forward to reading it :)

Anyway...

Can I just point out, the thread is more of a feedback thread for the actual reviews... I liked this... I wasn't a fan of how you described the graphics as opposed to... I disagree with your score (which helps no-one by the way :p).

The Pants Party
11-19-2007, 02:20 AM
Awh, I'm disappointed with the Blacksite review.
Pants, I thought you'd give it better since you were doing pretty well in multiplayer.
This game is definitely one that has to grow on you, and after three days of playing it, it's become my favourite 360 game to date.

It's also 48 dossiers, just count the list...

I liked the multiplayer better than any other part of it, to be honest. I just found the campaign to be so generic, it had nothing new to offer the FPS genre except the squad system, which was kind of broken.

Fixed the dossier typo. :)

Blackjaw x
11-19-2007, 02:38 AM
I just found the campaign to be so generic, it had nothing new to offer the FPS genre except the squad system, which was kind of broken.

Yeah, I thought the campaign was great until I died and then I just got this weird sense of frustration or something.. like I know it wasn't hard but it just irks me that I have to sit through 2 minutes of loading when I never even got to see what technically killed me.

Bluntman428
11-19-2007, 03:01 AM
I'm not saying that you can't hate it. I know a lot of people didn't like it and I think that's their loss. My whole point about the English was for professionalism. Just because people use the term that doesn't make it right. I'll level with you and say that your average person doesn't know the difference between Old English and Early Modern English. But your occasional reader is going to have paid attention in English class and know the difference. Perhaps they will disregard your entire review based on thinking you don't know what you're talking about. All I'm saying is 5 minutes of google searching could make a review 10x better.

I sincerely doubt anyone's really going to care less about using the term Old English instead of Early Modern English. Most people don't know the difference, few will care. It has nothing to do with professionalism as it pertains to videogames, because it has nothing to do with videogames, period. It's two words in a review. The only reason you're making a big deal of it is because you disagree with the score.

Honkymagoo
11-19-2007, 03:31 PM
I sincerely doubt anyone's really going to care less about using the term Old English instead of Early Modern English. Most people don't know the difference, few will care. It has nothing to do with professionalism as it pertains to videogames, because it has nothing to do with videogames, period. It's two words in a review. The only reason you're making a big deal of it is because you disagree with the score.

Why are you repeating things that I'm saying and then disagreeing? I said your average read will NOT know the difference. I'm not making a big deal about it at all. I'm simply pointing out a mistake in your review. You say I'm making a big deal because I don't agree with the score but it seems like you can't take a little constructive criticism.

How does it not pertain to professionalism? You are a reviewer for a website. People will come on the website and read your reviews. If your reviews are not up to par maybe people will be discouraged from using the website. This thread is called review feedback and I'm giving my fucking feedback.

Oh, and maybe part of the reason I care is due to the fact that my favorite subjects have always been English and History.

Bax x360a
11-19-2007, 07:52 PM
Maybe you should submit a review then and see if you can do better? Bluntman has done countless quality reviews, and just because you disagree with one and are a fanboy of the game dosen't mean you have the right to highly criticise his reviews; especially when theres barely anything wrong with it, if at all. Your feedback is welcome and expected but not if you keep harping on about the same subject, Bluntman clearly has a different opinion on the matter. Please carry on posting, but just concentrate on other reviews.

Honkymagoo
11-20-2007, 02:36 PM
Maybe you should submit a review then and see if you can do better? Bluntman has done countless quality reviews, and just because you disagree with one and are a fanboy of the game dosen't mean you have the right to highly criticise his reviews; especially when theres barely anything wrong with it, if at all. Your feedback is welcome and expected but not if you keep harping on about the same subject, Bluntman clearly has a different opinion on the matter. Please carry on posting, but just concentrate on other reviews.

Please realize that I am only posting in response to his posts. I am not trying to continue something that was settled. I was voicing my opinion on the subject and then giving my rebuttal after being challenged. I have my opinion. That does not make me a fanboy by any means. As I previously stated I am just trying to offer constructive criticism. Any good writer would be happy to have some.

Bluntman428
11-20-2007, 03:49 PM
Look bud, I'm not trying to sit here and argue with you about this dumb crap. It's a complete waste of time on both our parts. I'm not gonna change your mind about anything, and your complaining isn't going to change the game's score.

All I was trying to say is that the bit about the dialect is pretty irrelevant, and no one's really going to care about such a small detail that isn't technically wrong to begin with. It seems to me like you're just trying to make a big deal out of nothing because you disagree with the score. Which is fine, you're entitled to your opinion. But saying how unprofessional I am etc. crosses the line between feedback, and personal attacks. I've been on the review team for quite some time and written a number of reviews, most with nothing but positive feedback. However, no one likes it when you give a game a low score if they're a fan. It's the nature of the business.

There's really no need to keep beating the dead horse on this. If you have anything further to add, feel free to PM me, but let's keep the topic on track.

The Pants Party
11-20-2007, 05:01 PM
Ok, now that you two are done bickering... three by the always pleasant Graf1k. :p

Blazing Angels (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=47)
FarCry Instincts (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=59)
Saints Row (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/forum/../review.php?gameID=101)

LegendBoy
11-20-2007, 11:42 PM
Has anyone had a chance to look at my review of PDZ yet? I sent it by email a couple of days ago, its just the main body of text, I'm waiting for feedback before I add any screenshots or scores. Sorry if I'm being impatient, but thought I better check to see if you actually received it!

Webb
11-21-2007, 12:41 AM
Has anyone had a chance to look at my review of PDZ yet? I sent it by email a couple of days ago, its just the main body of text, I'm waiting for feedback before I add any screenshots or scores. Sorry if I'm being impatient, but thought I better check to see if you actually received it!

Did you send it to my e-mail? If so, I never got it. Probably got swept in to the Junk folder. Resend it with capitals in the title and I can keep an eye out then :)

LegendBoy
11-21-2007, 01:05 AM
I sent it to submit at xbox360achievements.org to begin with, maybe thats why no one received it. Is that address even used? Because I also sent achievement pics for Assassins Creed and Smackdown there, and haven't received a badge at all.

Webb
11-21-2007, 01:09 AM
Well the submit e-mail addy does work, but the first place we honestly check is the forums, so you probably won't get credit cause someone beat you to it.

Fire it to my e-mail address - dan.webb@x360a.org and I'll take a look on Friday and get back to you ASAP (can't do anything till Friday, too much to do, so little time :p).

Bluntman428
11-22-2007, 05:33 PM
Two new reviews up today, Project Gothem Racing 4 by the newest addition to the team utdalanbaxter, and Guitar Hero 3 by me.

Enjoy!

PerpetualHeaven
11-22-2007, 05:56 PM
Both excellent reviews. The GH3 review was hit spot on. I basically agree with absolutely everything in it except the visuals bit. Good job guys!

graf1k
11-22-2007, 07:20 PM
I haven't played either game yet so I couldn't comment, but they were both very well coded reviews! :D

Bax x360a
11-22-2007, 08:02 PM
Thanks PH and Graf, look for The Simpsons review up in a day or two. Wow, it is painful writing that :(

Blackjaw x
11-24-2007, 11:16 PM
I like all of the reviews themselves, it's just the scoring that seems to be off. Sometimes literally, for example: Shrek the Third has 76 on the list, but 70 when you click on it! Ratatouille is messed up in the same fashion, and I'm sure some others are as well.

But really, when I look at this list (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/reviews.php?sort=scoreASC) I simply cannot believe that some of these games were rated higher than some others. Not just from personal opinion, but general consensus and even how the review was written out!
For example, I think Far Cry and Blacksite (while perhaps no Gears of War or Halo 3 to most people) should be rated higher than horrendous movie-based titles such as Shrek, Ratatouille, Lord of The Rings and Harry Potter.

I think nearly every game on the list's score needs to be reconsidered. They have to be rearranged and changed to match the review itself and to compare well with the other games. If the better of two games is rated low, that's okay. But the worse of the two games shouldn't be rated any higher than the better one, even if it is still low.

Another example: Blacksite has campaign and multiplayer, above average graphics and replayability. In most people's eyes, it is frankly nowhere near Halo or Gears of War. That's fine, so maybe the 72 rating is fine.
But wait... Ratatouille has 75? If that is a fair rating for Ratatouille, Blacksite must be changed to a higher rating. The game is obviously worse, even if Blacksite is still bad.
So if either Blacksite and Far Cry (for example) are changed to ratings higher than the crappy movie games, or if those movie games are changed to ratings lower than the FPS games, it would solve the problem.

The Pants Party
11-25-2007, 05:18 AM
You've got to remember that these reviews are done by different people and the games are not rated against each other. If we started with one review (say Gears) and gave it a 95 or whatever, then based everything off that, whether it was better or worse than Gears, that's really no way to do a review.

These are afterall somewhat biased opinions on the reviewer's parts. I would have given a lot of the games different scores and other people on the team would give my games different scores I'm sure, but at the end of the day, each review states the facts of the game, plain and simple. I'd read the content of the review before bothering with the score. If the things the reviewer takes points off won't bother you, then ignore that part.

It's definitely hard to please everyone. Most people think Blacksite's score is pretty fair, but you happen to be a big fan of the game, so you'd wish it higher. Doesn't mean it necessarily needs to be. :)

Blackjaw x
11-25-2007, 07:31 PM
I know, but I just think it's obvious that any FPS game that is playable for at least 12 hours is better than a movie game that is boring, horribly designed and you'll never play again. Even the review you wrote for Blacksite and the one written for Far Cry say better things for those games than the very negative reviews for the movie games, yet the scores don't match that.

I didn't mean start over with giving one game a score and base the others around it, I just think from where we are right now some of them need to be adjusted. Not only to compare with other, obviously worse to anyone games but also to match the review itself.

Also, the scores for a few of the games are still different on the list than in the actual review. :P

Bluntman428
11-25-2007, 08:00 PM
We don't rate games against other games. We rate them based on the game itself.

Some movie games, like Ratatouille, are good games. As good as Gears or Halo? Not by a longshot. But good nonetheless. Just because a game falls into a certain genre, doesn't mean it's necessarily bad. Scores are based on the merit of the individual game, not what another game's rated.

Blackjaw x
11-25-2007, 08:10 PM
I know, they should initially be rated based on their own merit. However, when the review for Shrek is constantly putting it down, saying it's a horrible game and the Blacksite review says it's pretty good but nothing special, that should make Blacksite have at least a slightly higher score, no?

I just think the scores should match the reviews better and some of these games need to be re-scored. Not initially scored based on others, but just looked upon again. It's hard to explain what I mean, but it makes sense.

Webb
11-26-2007, 03:22 PM
I know, they should initially be rated based on their own merit. However, when the review for Shrek is constantly putting it down, saying it's a horrible game and the Blacksite review says it's pretty good but nothing special, that should make Blacksite have at least a slightly higher score, no?

I just think the scores should match the reviews better and some of these games need to be re-scored. Not initially scored based on others, but just looked upon again. It's hard to explain what I mean, but it makes sense.

Since you said something.... I've had a look at a large proportion of our review in relation to the average score section on Metacritic.com and our scores are pretty much consistent with the norm, except the odd score which is a bit off, I really can't see your problem. I understand that just because you like Blacksite and that other kid liked FarCry, these games are jumping in to a field with so many other FPS titles and unless they stand out, they will be just another "average" game.

PerpetualHeaven
11-26-2007, 04:41 PM
Actually, the average metacritic rating of Ratatouille is 56. Only one site gave it an 80 and the rest gave it 68 and below. I think his main concern was that a lackluster game like Ratatouille received an 80 whereas other games of much better quality such as Hitman Blood Money received similar or lower scores.

Either way, they are "reviews" for a reason. It's one persons review on a single game. The odds of it being similar to your opinion are very slim. Different strokes for different folks you know? Because one person thinks that Ratatouille and Harry Potter Order of Phoneix are good games and comparable in quality to something like TDU then that's his/her opinion. That's basically what a review is. Just an opinion. You can agree or disagree with the persons opinion, but you cannot change it.

Webb
11-26-2007, 04:45 PM
lol I never looked at Ratatouille, I just took a sample lol

Everything that I checked was on the mark then, how's that? :p

PerpetualHeaven
11-26-2007, 04:54 PM
Meow. :p Yeah, I'm not saying anything lol I'm just saying the scores are all opinionated. We can agree or disagree but we can't really force someone to change their opinion. If Rocket thought Ratatouille was worthy of an 80, then good for him. I'm sure 99% of the population would disagree but he wrote the review and that's his cup of tea. Just like Two World or The Hour of Victory review. There will always be someone who's going to say, "Are you insane? It was like the bestest/worstest game ever."

Bluntman428
11-26-2007, 06:59 PM
Well, Ratatouille and Harry Potter were both written by Rocket. He's not on the team anymore, and frankly he was a pretty shitty writer. He gave a lot of odd scores out, because he was a odd guy. He left the team to be the SUPER-LEAD-REVIEWER-IN-CHARGE at a site that doesn't even have a homepage yet. Just a bunch of bitter nerds on forums talking about how awesome their site's going to be when they actually, you know, have a site.

Most reviews are around "the norm" in terms of scoring. I know most of us don't really look at other reviews before we rate a game, since that kinda defeats the purpose of writing our own reviews. But if a score's too high/low, other people on the team who've played the game bring it up, and usually it's adjusted. The editing and feedback process is pretty extensive, everyone on the team is able to provide their input on any given review before it's published.

Blackjaw x
11-26-2007, 08:09 PM
Well, Ratatouille and Harry Potter were both written by Rocket. He's not on the team anymore, and frankly he was a pretty shitty writer. He gave a lot of odd scores out, because he was a odd guy. He left the team to be the SUPER-LEAD-REVIEWER-IN-CHARGE at a site that doesn't even have a homepage yet. Just a bunch of bitter nerds on forums talking about how awesome their site's going to be when they actually, you know, have a site.

Alright well then I think these kids games he reviewed should be marked down a bit then, not even just to compare them to the rest but just from general opinion.
I bet if we took a poll of 100 people, 95 of them wouldn't give these games higher than 6/10.

I thought the point of a review was to help people choose a good game.
If people looked at these reviews, they would be telling them go out and buy Shrek instead Far Cry.
I can't think of anyone over the age of 10 who, if had these two games held out to them and told to choose one, would pick Shrek.
Even if they don't like either, it's still not right to say Shrek is better when the consensus is clearly that it is not.

Also, I don't think a review should be opinion anyway. That would be an editorial.
A review should judge the game based on what it is, not how they personally liked it.
For example, I'd give Blacksite a personal review of 10/10.
But if I was to write a public review that wasn't based on opinion, more the game mechanics (like they're supposed to be) I'd give it a 7/10 because I can tell (although I have tons of fun playing it) that it is simply not as quality of a game as others.

Again, apart from just me saying the game deserves higher/lower, I also think from reading the reviews themselves that the score doesn't match the rest of the review in some cases.

Also - has anyone fixed the fact that Shrek and Ratatouille have higher scores on the review than in the list? That, if anything, should be fixed at least!

Webb
11-26-2007, 08:18 PM
Also - has anyone fixed the fact that Shrek and Ratatouille have higher scores on the review than in the list? That, if anything, should be fixed at least!

That was just an input error. I changed two yesterday, it might have been them.

saoix2
11-26-2007, 09:46 PM
Also, I don't think a review should be opinion anyway. That would be an editorial.
A review should judge the game based on what it is, not how they personally liked it.
For example, I'd give Blacksite a personal review of 10/10.
But if I was to write a public review that wasn't based on opinion, more the game mechanics (like they're supposed to be) I'd give it a 7/10 because I can tell (although I have tons of fun playing it) that it is simply not as quality of a game as others.

Again, apart from just me saying the game deserves higher/lower, I also think from reading the reviews themselves that the score doesn't match the rest of the review in some cases.



I almost agree with that. I agree that reviews should look at a more technical standpoint, frame rate, A.I. Bugs etc. I believe that writers address these problems quite well, but maybe we should focus in a little bit more on it. However, a review is in fact Opinion. All reviews are personal opinion, on any subject or product. An editorial that you refer to is generally reserved for greater subjects or actions. Such as Multi-player on the PS3, or how is Microsoft handling fallout rates for faulty 360's. Etc Etc.

Also, I don't think any of our reviewers compare games when doing a review, each score is supposed to stand on its own.

I and I hope all reviewers try to be fair and objective. For example: I f'in loved Call of Duty 4, LOVED it. In fact if it were a woman, I would settle down with it, have a few children and be happy with the rest of my life. But there were flaws that distracted me from the overall experience, and I don't think reviewers look over these mistakes. If they were to look over these mistakes due to product bias, then obviously they are not doing their jobs as a reviewer. Which is:

To provide the public with thier honest and unbiased opinion.

It is best to look at the game you are reviewing from a objective standpoint. Even if you want to marry it...

^_~

PerpetualHeaven
11-27-2007, 02:25 AM
Alright well then I think these kids games he reviewed should be marked down a bit then, not even just to compare them to the rest but just from general opinion.
I bet if we took a poll of 100 people, 95 of them wouldn't give these games higher than 6/10.

I thought the point of a review was to help people choose a good game.
If people looked at these reviews, they would be telling them go out and buy Shrek instead Far Cry.
I can't think of anyone over the age of 10 who, if had these two games held out to them and told to choose one, would pick Shrek.
Even if they don't like either, it's still not right to say Shrek is better when the consensus is clearly that it is not.

Also, I don't think a review should be opinion anyway. That would be an editorial.
A review should judge the game based on what it is, not how they personally liked it.
For example, I'd give Blacksite a personal review of 10/10.
But if I was to write a public review that wasn't based on opinion, more the game mechanics (like they're supposed to be) I'd give it a 7/10 because I can tell (although I have tons of fun playing it) that it is simply not as quality of a game as others.

Again, apart from just me saying the game deserves higher/lower, I also think from reading the reviews themselves that the score doesn't match the rest of the review in some cases.

Also - has anyone fixed the fact that Shrek and Ratatouille have higher scores on the review than in the list? That, if anything, should be fixed at least!

There are plenty of sites who have skewed review scores. They're done by different people and of course result in different opinions. Have you seen scores for games? Even the best game can range from high 90s to low 70s. Yes, of course they're a little high but that was the reviewers choice. You cannot change ones opinion.

Sanction
11-27-2007, 02:44 AM
I think the overall score for The Simpsons is a tad low, a 75 would have done nicely, I enjoyed the game very much :D.

I like the writing style of whoever wrote that review too, kudos.

Bax x360a
11-27-2007, 12:13 PM
I think the overall score for The Simpsons is a tad low, a 75 would have done nicely, I enjoyed the game very much :D.

I like the writing style of whoever wrote that review too, kudos.
That would be me, thank you sir for the kind comment. It was a pretty good game to play through, but i couldnt really give it any higher due to the lack of playability after you've completed it once.

Blackjaw x
04-13-2008, 10:09 PM
I don't mean to nitpick but to be honest I've seen so many spelling and grammar errors in the reviews that I felt the need to post here.

I'm just wondering if you have editors on the review team... often when someone writes something they can read it over multiple times without seeing any errors but for some reason if you get someone else to read it even once they can spot many errors.

If you want, I could point out specifically where the errors lie, but I'm not going to without approval.

Bax x360a
04-13-2008, 10:17 PM
I don't mean to nitpick but to be honest I've seen so many spelling and grammar errors in the reviews that I felt the need to post here.

I'm just wondering if you have editors on the review team... often when someone writes something they can read it over multiple times without seeing any errors but for some reason if you get someone else to read it even once they can spot many errors.

If you want, I could point out specifically where the errors lie, but I'm not going to without approval.
Not in mine I hope :p In all seriousness, we do have editors. Highpass does an awesome job, with Otis helping out aswell. They can't catch everything mate...

Otisbum
04-13-2008, 10:17 PM
You have my approval. Are you referring to newer reviews, or the older ones?

highpass
04-13-2008, 10:20 PM
Yeah please do point out these mistakes - I was under the assumption we had a good track record with this.

Blackjaw x
04-13-2008, 10:24 PM
You have my approval. Are you referring to newer reviews, or the older ones?

One of the new ones was rather filled with them, more so being grammar than spelling in this case but still.

I never noticed the issue until the last couple batches (maybe I just wasn't looking) and I think the problem may be that you've been working hard to review every single game so some mistakes have been missed.

I'm not sure how I should point them out... in a post or a private message and if you want me to just go in order from top to bottom and list the mistakes alone or post the whole review with them highlighted.

Otisbum
04-13-2008, 10:25 PM
If it's one of mine, feel free to post the link and which paragraphs have the errors in them.

I'll be back in about a half hour.

highpass
04-13-2008, 10:25 PM
PM me with the mistakes and CC Otis in on it, ta

Marx0r
04-13-2008, 10:27 PM
Yeah please do point out these mistakes - I was under the assumption we had a good track record with this.

If you say so, in the summary for the Trophy Bucks review (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/game/cabelas-trophy-bucks/review)

it says:

" The animals on offer are hardly game that people would willingly pursue outside of real life..."

In the context, I think that's supposed to be "outside of a video game" or "in real life".

highpass
04-13-2008, 10:32 PM
Sorted, thanks Marx0r. Please PM if there's any more (don't want to derail this thread too much).

Marx0r
04-13-2008, 10:34 PM
Sorted, thanks Marx0r. Please PM if there's any more (don't want to derail this thread too much).

Will do, apparently I missed the 8 posts previous to my original one while I was trying to find the review. :p

Tussell
04-13-2008, 10:35 PM
Maybe a Type Review thread could be worked out?

highpass
04-13-2008, 10:37 PM
Type Review? What you mean?

I'd rather anyone PMd about these things - to be honest there shouldn't be any mistakes in the first place which is down to me at the end of the day.

Otisbum
04-13-2008, 10:55 PM
And if anyone finds a review with an obscenely large amount of errors, just send me a link to the whole thing and I'll proofread it in entirety.

Tussell
04-13-2008, 10:57 PM
Hahaha. I meant 'Typo'.
How ironic!

Otisbum
04-13-2008, 11:06 PM
:D Awesome.

Yeah, that could potentially work. As long as we can keep it from turning into a "This review has an error, the score should be higher/lower" thread.

I say we move discussion of this sort of thing into the Review forum, that way we can disregard the other users' input go into more detail. ;)

jackanape
04-14-2008, 10:56 AM
A lot of those new reviews are mine so if there is a problem with grammar I'd certainly like to know about it so the same mistakes aren't being made over and over again.

Feel free to PM me, or highpass could do so once he knows what the issues are.