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-   -   Guide to Universal Leaderboard Achievement (plus Team and Solo) (http://www.xboxachievements.com/forum/showthread.php?t=203567)

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 07:57 PM

Guide to Universal Leaderboard Achievement (plus Team and Solo)
 
Almost done with my guide to getting Universal #1. Feel free to ask questions about anything I am posting. If something needs to be explained better, I will do so and edit the guide for others as well.

GRAW Leaderboards:
*Disclaimer: None of the gamertag/E-mail address/password combinations listed by me in this guide are real. They are just made up names so that those who are looking for a visual example will have something to start from.

*Note: If you are going to attempt to get the Universal Leaderboard achievement, you must dedicate several months and a lot of money to it. It is VERY helpful to get a group together that you trust and work well together, thus speeding the process up, and splitting the cost. Splitting the board creation/maintenance between people will require that each person will keep their accounts in one area of the ladder and push/be pushed in games between different people's xboxs. The best and most fair way is to have each person create an equal amount of the accounts; for two people, each person makes and maintains of them, for three people, each person does 1/3 of them, etc. Once everyone in your group has gotten the Universal Leaderboard achievement, your accounts are yours to do with as you see fit, within the Xbox Live Terms of Service and Code of Conduct. Your main, primary, real, (whatever you want to call it) account does not, and should not be recovered by anyone else as there is no need to.

How the leaderboard system works:
*Not all ranks are the same. Think of each rank as having tenths, so when you see a rank 4, it could be a 4.0, 4.1, 4.2,…4.9 This is a VERY important thing to understand for later. Once you grasp this concept, take it the next level and understand that ranks go into the hundredths as well (4.00, 4.01, 4.02, etc.) although 99% of the time this is irrelevant).

*Rank 1.0 is the absolute lowest rank there is, no matter how many losses that account has, it will never drop to 0.99!!! Therefore, two rank 1’s can play with one winning every round/match, the final result will be 1.0 and 5.0 (one of the few times an account will end up exactly at a X.0 rank).

*Anyone can play against anyone in a ranked match. However, the match only counts if the winner is not more than 4.0 ranks higher than the loser. So if you are a rank 10 and lose to a rank 1 it counts, but if the rank 1 loses to you, it does not count. For example if you are close to making rank 11, you are a 10.9 and will get credit for winning against anyone who is a 6.9 or higher.

*Kills, deaths, captures done within the first 30 seconds of a match do not count. Matches that end within 30 seconds do not count at all.

*In Team, you can have 1 vs 1, 2 vs 1, 1 vs 2, and 2 vs 2 matches on a single Xbox. A 2v2 match takes the same amount of time as a 1v1 match, and has the same result as running 2 separate 1v1 matches. A 2v1/1v2 match will result in the team of 2 moving up/down at half the speed as the single team, and the single team will move up/down at the normal speed. So a team of 2 losing to a single account would cause the single to go up 2 ranks for every 1 rank the team of 2 drops. So a team of 11.0’s losing to a single 11.0 will result in the team going down 1.33 ranks and the single going up 2.66 ranks, final result: the team will be 9.66’s and the single will be a 13.66.

*Due to running matches on Auto-Pilot (explained in Definitions & Methods) the ladder should be built on team matches only. Plus, team matches are the only way to have 2v2 matches.

*The leaderboard has 3 levels with different characteristics for ranking up/down:
**Ranks 1.0-9.0: you rank up a little faster than you lose rank.
**Ranks 9.1-21.0: you rank up at the same speed you lose rank.
**Ranks 21.1-25.9: you rank up a lot slower than you lose rank.

*To get Universal #1, you must make it to spot #1, but you can do so in team, solo, or a mix of the two. Should you lose a match while going for Universal #1, do not worry about it. The only time losing a match will cause problems is if you are a rank 25 when you lose the match (explained in Rank 25).

*To get Team or Solo #1, you must have X number of wins more than losses in that mode. You may be a rank 1 or a rank 25 when you get #1 in Team or Solo. To get either achievement, you will need to derank (explained in Definitions & Methods).

*Update 5/4/10: When deranking, you will get to a point that you are so low on the Team/Solo board that additional losses will not hurt your position any more. It is like being a Rank 1.0 in Universal, you can continue to lose matches and you don't drop any farther.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 07:58 PM

Definitions and Methods Used:
*Standard Setup: Setup a Team Match with the following options – Siege Customized to have Respawns = 0, and lobby options of: Max Players = X (number of accounts that will be participating in the match), Auto Launch = 30 seconds, Time = 5 Minutes, Map = Boneyard. Once the game clock counts down 31 seconds (4:29 left) have one of the losing players drop a frag grenade at their feet and kill the entire losing team. If left unattended, the match will end after 5 minutes and the winning team will get credit for winning and the game will start the next match 30 seconds after the previous one. Pros: Every kill/match counts as user ensures no kills/deaths occur withing the first 30 seconds. Cons: Every kill/match must be done manually or let the match take a full 5 minutes.

*Auto-Pilot: Use the Standard Setup with the additional Siege Customization of Helicopters = On. This will result in a helicopter spawning when the match starts and killing the losing team. Since there are no respawns allowed, the match will end as soon as the entire losing team is killed. The 30 second Auto Launch will cause the next match to start 30 seconds after the previous one ends. And in the event the helicopter fails to kill the entire losing team, the match will end naturally after 5 minutes. Pros: Average match time is about a minute with no user intervention once the game has been set up. Cons: Helicopter can occasionally kill an enemy almost instantly so not all kills/matches will count.

*Standard/Swapped Start Locations: In a 2v2 match on the same box, players A1 & A3 will be on one team while A2 & A4 are on the other. In Standard start location, A1 & A3 will be the winners and A2 & A4 will be the losers. In Swapped, the exact opposite is the case, A2 & A4 are the winners while A1 & A3 are the losers. For 1v2 and 2v1 matches, be sure the team of 1 is player A2 as A1 & A3 will be on the same team, the Standard/Swapped rules remain the same except there is no A4.

*Alternating: Use the Auto-Pilot Setup with the additional lobby option of Spawn Location = Alternating. This will result in the teams alternating between being the winner and loser. This is only useful for teams that are lower than a 9.0 as ranks 1.0-9.0 give more points to the winner than the loser loses, therefore both teams will gain points and eventually get to about 9.0. Interestingly, should you alternate a team of 5’s against a team of 7’s, the higher team will somehow drop until they are at the same level as the lower team and then both teams will start going up. Pros: Fewer teams needed as no need for teams at 1 or 5, and teams at 7 will “recharge” themselves to 9.0. Cons: it takes approximately 24 hours for 2 teams/accounts to alternate from 7’s to 9’s.

*Pushing: having the team/account that is lowest already lose to the team/account that is higher. Check the universal leaderboard before starting a match to determine who is in the higher spot. This should be done for every match unless you are deranking someone who has already gotten to spot #1.

*Pulling: Having the team/account that is higher lose to the team/account that is in the lower spot. This should only be done by the current #1 to pull the next person up and reduce the number of times the second person needs to be pushed by the ladder.

*Deranking: Winning matches in one mode (team or solo) then losing matches in the other mode. This is the only effective way to get the team and solo leaderboard achievements. Playing team matches only, with no losses in team or solo, you will only be around spot #70 on team when you achieve universal #1. It is faster to derank in solo and rank back up in team than it would be to keep rebuilding the ladder to keep winning in team, plus it would make it even harder for the next person to get to universal #1 as you would basically be blocking others from getting it.

Prep work if working with others to get the achievements:
If you don’t already have an account with Gmail, get one. It allows you to create and share documents with friends (compare screenshots at the end, one is Gmail's spreadsheet, others are MicroSoft Excel). In this case, “friends” will be the other people in your group working on this. Once you have a spreadsheet shared, each person will need to be able to edit the ladder to update stats on the teams. Once the ladder is established, whomever has the most time and/or most 360’s at their disposal must be the person in charge of maintaining the bottom of the ladder (running the Alternating matches). But to start, everyone needs to help establish the bottom of the ladder. Before creating the first account to start, make sure there is a clear plan of who is going to do what, when, and how, and what order everyone will be in to get the achievements. This will reduce confusion and ensure no one is off “doing their own thing” and screwing up the plan everyone else is going by.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 07:59 PM

Building the ladder:
Make nice short names for the GamerTags, create similar E-mail accounts for them all, and use the same password for every one of them (and make sure to NOT use the same password you use for ANYTHING else, especially money related). This will make it easy to recover them in case you do not have enough memory to have them all saved at the same time (you can have 9-10 gamertags per each hard drive and memory card you have). Up until Rank 9.0, the winner will get slightly more points than the loser will lose, so 2 teams of 5.0’s will result in teams of approximately 7.1 and 3.1. From Rank 9.0 up to 21, the winner gains the same amount as the loser loses, so 2 teams of 11.0’s will result in a team of 13.0’s and the other being 9.0’s. The first team that gets created will be a/the dedicated pusher team. This team will lose every match so that all the other teams will start off as Rank 5.0’s. Once there are 2 teams of 5.0’s they can play each other, making a team of 7’s and a team of 3’s. Have pusher team re-push the 3’s back to 5.0’s. Play 2 more teams of 5.0’s to get a second team of 7’s. Play the 7’s against each other to get a team of 9’s and a team of 5’s. Keep this process up (pushers pushing a team to 5’s, 2 teams of 5’s making a team of 7’s, 2 teams of 7’s making a team of 9’s, 2 teams of 9’s making a team of 11’s, etc.

Once the teams have been created, and you have pushed every team as high as you can, it is time to start bringing everyone up to 9’s or above. First, push every person in your group (your “real” accounts that will be going for the achievements) up to 9’s as well so that they don’t get left behind at Rank 1. Next get to a point where you only have one account or team at Rank 1, another at Rank 5, and another at Rank 7 with all others at least a Rank 9. If you have a team of 2 at Rank 1, alternate them until they are Rank 5’s, then have them alternate against the Rank 5’s to bring both teams up. If you only have 1 account at Rank 1, let it win against the Rank 5 until they are equal and then start alternating (reread the Alternating method to see why). Don’t worry if you leave a team or account at Rank 7, when you play 2 teams/accounts of Rank 9’s, you’ll have a second team/account at 7 to alternate them up to 9’s.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 07:59 PM

Finishing the ladder:
Now that you have made all the teams at least a Rank 9.0, it is time to “complete” the ladder. You should have at least 3 teams of 9’s. Play 2 of them to get 11’s and 7’s. Play the 2 teams of 11’s to get 13’s and 9’s. You now have 2 teams of 9’s again, play them to get 11’s and 7’s. You now have 2 teams of 7’s, run them on alternating for 24 hours to get both back to 9’s while two teams climb the ladder, you’ll end up with 2 teams alternating up from 7’s to 9’s and one team dropping from 11’s to 9’s from an 11/11 match. You now have 3 teams of 9’s again. Play 2 to get 11’s and 7’s, then 2 teams of 11’s to get 13’s and 9’s, then the 2 teams of 9’s to get 11’s and 7’s, then alternate the 7’s as two teams climb the ladder. Rinse, Lather, Repeat. Rinse, Lather, Repeat. Rinse, Lather, Repeat. Rinse, Lather, Repeat. Rinse, Lather, Repeat. (This will take a lot of Rinse, Lather, Repeating).

Top of the ladder:
Once you get teams up to Rank 21 the game changes again, the winning team goes up approximately 1.0 ranks while the loser drops 3.0 ranks. 2 teams of 21’s will make a team of 22’s and a team of 18’s. 2 teams of 22’s will make 23’s & 19’s. 2 teams of 23’s will make 24’s and 20’s.

There are two ways you can handle the top of the ladder. The way the group I was in did it is very demoralizing because we had teams all the way up to Rank 24’s because it made sense to do that. So to get a team up to Rank 24, you need 2 teams at Rank 23. To get 2 teams at Rank 23, you need 4 teams at Rank 22. And to get 4 teams up to Rank 22, you need 8 teams of 21’s. That means you need to push 8 teams all the way up the ladder just to get one team to Rank 24. And if you are using teams of one, you really should get a second team up to Rank 24 (making it 16 teams pushed up the ladder) so that the person going for the achievement can win a 1v2 match as it takes several teams at Rank 24 for whomever is going for #1 to get there.

The way I found at the end of my group’s effort seems less logical, but it is much less demoralizing. The goal is to get to spot #1 which is the highest Rank 25, right? So if spot #1 equals a Rank 25.9, it can gain points by winning against anyone who is above a 21.9, right? So here’s what to do, get two teams to 21’s, play them against each other to create a team of 22’s. If you have teams of two, skip the next sentence. If you have teams of ones, get another team up to Rank 22. Now that you have two accounts at Rank 22, let them push the person going for #1 in a 1v2 match. There are fewer accounts needed to do it this way, and less time between pushes. And, once the person going to for the achievement gets to Rank 25, the two accounts pushing will not drop below 21.0 thus making it even easier and faster to prepare for the next push. And less time between pushes up will make it at least seem like the process is going faster.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 08:00 PM

Rank 25:
Rank 25 is a beast of its own. Due to people previously trying to boost so high that others could not get the achievement, this single rank has properties that don’t match any others. It would take several low Rank 25’s pushing a single other Rank 25 to go from a 25.0 to a 25.9. If a Rank 25 loses just one single round, they will instantly drop several spots on the leaderboard, even though it took many, many, many wins to go up the same amount they dropped after just one loss. But a Rank 25 still gets credit for wins against any other account that is within 4.0 ranks below. The first person in our group got to spot #1, he stayed there until the second person climbed the leaderboard. The second person made it to around spot #7 before playing against the first person. After just one match between the two, the first person dropped from spot #1 to spot #14 (lowest Rank 25 at the time). It took a couple hours for the first person to drop to a Rank 24, and by the time the second person got #1, the first person was a very low Rank 22. When I went for the achievement, the second person also dropped from spot #1 to #14 after just 1 match. The current #1 (Cody) made it to spot #7 and lost just one match and dropped as well, it took just as long to get back to spot #7 as it took to get there the first time. Which, using the 9 teams of 2 and only two Xboxes running for part of a day at a time, it took 29 days for him to climb up to #1 after that one loss as a Rank 25.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 08:00 PM

Completed Ladder – Teams of Two (8 teams/16 accounts required, 9 teams/18 accounts highly recommended):
Once you have all of the accounts created and in place to for your ladder, you should have the following:
Rank 21: 1 team (Next team up the ladder will make it to 22’s)
Rank 19: 1 team
Rank 17: 1 team
Rank 15: 1 team
Rank 13: 1 team
Rank 11: 1 team
Rank 9: 1 team
Rank 7: 2 teams* (Alternate to 9’s, results in two teams climbing the ladder)
*Could get by with only 1 team of 7’s. Alternate against each other to get to 9’s, but would take same amount of time to alternate to 9’s as 2 teams of 2, and result in only 1 team climbing the ladder.

Completed Ladder – Teams of One (10 teams/accounts required, 12 highly recommended):
Once you have all of the accounts created and in place to for your ladder, you should have the following:
Rank 22: 1 team
Rank 21: 1 team (Next “team” up the ladder will make a second account at 22)
Rank 19: 1 team
Rank 17: 1 team
Rank 15: 1 team
Rank 13: 1 team
Rank 11: 1 team
Rank 9: 1 team
Rank 7: 2 teams* (Alternate to 9’s, results in two teams climbing the ladder)
*There really should be 4 rank 7’s to alternate in 2 teams of 2 here. Result would be five teams at 9, give more than one account going up the ladder after each alternating session.

Completed Ladder – Teams of Two up to Rank 24 (10 teams/20 accounts required, 11 teams/22 accounts highly recommended):
Once you have all of the accounts created and in place to for your ladder, you should have the following:
Rank 23: 1 team (Next team up the ladder will make it to 24’s)
Rank 22: 1 team
Rank 21: 1 team
Rank 19: 1 team
Rank 17: 1 team
Rank 15: 1 team
Rank 13: 1 team
Rank 11: 1 team
Rank 9: 1 team
Rank 7: 2 teams* (Alternate to 9’s, results in two teams climbing the ladder)
*Could get by with only 1 team of 7’s. Alternate against each other to get to 9’s, but would take same amount of time to alternate to 9’s as 2 teams of 2, and result in only 1 team climbing the ladder.

Completed Ladder – Teams of One up to Rank 24 (12 teams/accounts required, 14 highly recommended):
Once you have all of the accounts created and in place to for your ladder, you should have the following:
Rank 24: 1 team
Rank 23: 1 team (Next “team” up the ladder will make a second account at 24)
Rank 22: 1 team
Rank 21: 1 team
Rank 19: 1 team
Rank 17: 1 team
Rank 15: 1 team
Rank 13: 1 team
Rank 11: 1 team
Rank 9: 1 team
Rank 7: 2 teams* (Alternate to 9’s, results in two teams climbing the ladder)
*There really should be 4 rank 7’s to alternate in 2 teams of 2 here. Result would be five teams at 9, give more than one account going up the ladder after each alternating session.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 08:01 PM

When we did this (teams of two all the way to Rank 24) this is how it worked for pushing someone up to spot #1. Using the fully built/rebuilt ladder, pushing one Rank 9 up with 2 Rank 9s, then 2 Rank 11’s, etc., the Rank 24’s pushed the person going up to spot #10. So then what? We had to Rebuild!! Make another team of 24.9’s and play against them. We got pushed up to #7. Rebuild. We made it to #5. Rebuild. We got it on that run. Then we rebuilt the ladder for the next person. When the next person made it to #7, they deranked the person still sitting at #1. This will saved two rebuilds for person #2, and by the time you get this far along, you will understand why two rebuilds will sound like forever… Then we left person #2 at spot #1 until person #3 got to spot #7 and let person #3 derank person #2. Once person #2 deranked person #1, person #1 continued to derank themselves farther by pushing teams up to help speed up the ladder rebuild process, which helped get the ladder ready for person #3 a little quicker.

What’s up with this talk of the process being demoralizing? This sounds easy!
Well, just like knowledge is different from wisdom, simple is different from easy. Setting up the matches and letting them run on Auto-Pilot is simple to do, but it takes a long, long, long time. Let’s say you’ve already put in the many hours it takes to build the ladder and have the ladder built all the way up and you are a rank 9. How long will it take you to climb the ladder?

Well, if you have teams of two, and have them all the way up to Rank 24, you will play each team from the 9’s through the 19’s for about 3 hours each. That’s 18 hours automatically. Now it will be about 4 hours for the teams at 21, 22, and 23. You are now at 30 hours. And the 24’s will take about 6-8 hours to play. So about 38 hours to climb the ladder. But wait, your ladder is now in shambles, you now have teams at 7, 9, 9, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 18, 19, 20, and 21, and while you are a rank 25, you are around spot #10. So you play the 9’s to get 11’s & 7’s, then play the 11’s, 13’s, 15’s, 17’s, 19’s, and 21’s to get a team up to 22, which takes about 21 hours (and results in no 21’s). Don’t forget 24 hours to alternate the 2 teams of 7’s to get them back up to 9’s. So now there are 3 teams at 9 again, the first team up will take 18 hours to get to 21, but no 19’s now. Luckily there is a team at 20, so just play them as 19’s for the next team up. The second team will climb up the ladder, playing the 20’s when they reach 19’s, and will result in a second team at 22 after about 21 hours. Another 3-4 hours will result in 23’s, but now there are no 21’s or 22’s. Meanwhile, the 7’s have to alternate another 24 hours to reach 9’s. That is approximately 111 hours to get one team to a rank 23. Repeat the process and another 111 hours will give you a second team at rank 23. Add 4 hours to play them and get a rank 24. That process just took about 225 hours of running matches. Now, as a rank 25, play against the 24’s. You make it to spot #7, so guess what, another 225 hours of matches to get another team back to rank 24. Play that team and you’ll end up around spot #5. And guess what? Yep, you guessed it, yet another 225 hours for another team of rank 24’s. Play them, and hope you get it. If not, you’ve got another 225 hours of matches to get the final push.

So to recap: less than 40 hours to climb a complete ladder from rank 9 to rank 25. But at least 675 hours to go from spot #10 to #1 on the Universal Leaderboard, or 900 hours if you need an extra push. So how long is that in days? Well, if you are there to stop each match as soon as it is done and start the next one immediately after (so every 3 hours except for the alternating), you are looking at between 28.125 and 37.5 days. But what if you only run your box for about 12 hours a day? Then you are looking at 56 to 74 days. Oh, and you better hope your Xbox does not RRoD or E74 on you, or there is an extra delay in waiting for MircoSoft to repair it…

The current universal #1 is Cody. Cody is one of my dummy accounts, which I used to test the 9 teams of 2 system after I got the universal #1 achievement. As soon as Cody got the achievement, I stopped playing ranked matches with him and he has not played GRAW since. So as long as Cody is #1, then you can achieve universal #1. But know that anyone who is higher than Cody could be continuing to gain rank to make it harder or impossible for others to get the achievement. Without giving the full gamertag I will give you a ballpark idea of how long it will take to climb past the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 5th place accounts... It will take several pushes from a team of 2 rank 22's just to pass the Mexican account. Once you pass the Mexican one, you will make it to the Hated Ones fairly quickly. But it will take about 2 hours to pass the Hated Ones. Once you pass both of them, it should only take 1 more round to pass Cody and get the achievement (assuming no one is above Cody when you get to that point).

Update 5/4/10:
I have now fully completed the game, and have one of my dummies at the top of each leaderboard, each is just 1 win above 2nd place. Cody is #1 in Universal, Rex is #1 in Solo, and Bly is #1 in Team. As long as those three stay #1 on the three leaderboards, then it is still possible to get those leaderboard achievements. But, should anyone pass them and remain above them, then they are either blocking the leaderboard(s) or just did not derank in that mode.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 08:03 PM

5 Attachment(s)
Here are examples of the four different ladder types/methods. Again, these gamertags and E-mail addresses are made up. I am just giving examples of what to do.

GRAW Example is what your Gmail spreadsheet should look like, 24 is the same image, but from Excel view (to give a comparison). They also have highlighed blocks to the right of the ladder to show what matches are to be played next.

Sorry for the small image size, I'm not sure why the screenshots came out so small.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-22-2010 08:07 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Once again, these gamertag/E-mail/password combos are all fake, just giving a visual example to make it easier for others.

As you can see from this screen, by having the gamertags in pairs like this you can instantly know what four accounts are to play against each other as soon as you see the team names of who is to play. For example, you need to play team Alpha vs team Bravo, so the tags Alpha1 & Alpha2 will face off against Bravo1 & Bravo2. And should you have to recover team Bravo, you don't need to look up what the E-mail address or password is to recover them.

dakisbac 01-22-2010 08:37 PM

I was thinking about doing this myself, but I guess I won't bother now.

NeoGeo18 01-23-2010 12:53 PM

Very good tips Aerocoupe, I was wondering if you knew roughly how many times you would need to play a team of two 22's against a 25 to get to number 1 spot. Im currently helping its arms get there before he then returns the favour. Its arms is currently 12th in the boards and ive been boosting him up off of my secondary level 22 since he reached a level 25, however as I do not have such an established ladder as yours suggested im struggling to now get my this secondary account back upto a 22 to push him any higher.

NeoGeo18 01-23-2010 01:32 PM

Also just to give you a little info on the solo boards not suggesting that you need it, lol. It took me about a month and a half from start to finish to get the Solo no1 achievement. I only used two accounts in this process, my main and a secondary account. The process possibly could be speeded up using more accounts but at a far greater cost. To push my main account up the solo boards I would setup a ranked, solo elim or solo objective match. I would then put the settings to 0 respawns or to 5 seconds depending on the gametype I was playing. I would then play my secondary account in one of these gametypes and after 30 seconds I would beat the secondary account with my main, either by killing it or capturing the base. I would do this until my main account was 4 levels higher than my secondary i.e. main=5 secondary=1. It takes about 2-3 hours to get your main four levels higher than your secondary. At this point, I would then setup a team territory ranked match, siege, no respawns and with helicopters on. I would have my main account signed in as the second player and the secondary signed in as the first player. I would then start the game up, this method results in the helicopter killing your main account and basically switches the rank back the opposite way, so eventually your accounts look like this i.e main=1 secondary=5. It takes between 4 and 6 hours to completely switch over your rank using this method, no matter what levels your accounts are. Using this method each day I would play 1 solo session in the morning until my main was 4 levels higher, I would then have a team session until the ranks were switched over, so secondary 4 levels higher. Then in the evening I would have another solo session before finally leaving it on team overnight. Using this method I would actually have to play for around 5-6 hours a day, leaving my console on roughly 18 hours a day.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-23-2010 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeoGeo18 (Post 2724317)
Very good tips Aerocoupe, I was wondering if you knew roughly how many times you would need to play a team of two 22's against a 25 to get to number 1 spot. Im currently helping its arms get there before he then returns the favour. Its arms is currently 12th in the boards and ive been boosting him up off of my secondary level 22 since he reached a level 25, however as I do not have such an established ladder as yours suggested im struggling to now get my this secondary account back upto a 22 to push him any higher.

I didn't keep track of that when pushing Cody up. But I was getting 2 high 22's to push him about once every other to once every 3rd day, so about 2-3 pushes a week, for 4 weeks. But I can't remember exactly where Cody was when I used the last 1 month codes I had, I want to say I had gotten him back to about #7 or #8. So I am going to estimate that you would have to give him 12-18 pushes if you had a pair of 22's up there, 24-36 since you only have one...

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-23-2010 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeoGeo18 (Post 2724375)
To push my main account up the solo boards I would setup a ranked, solo elim or solo objective match. I would then put the settings to 0 respawns or to 5 seconds depending on the gametype I was playing. I would then play my secondary account in one of these gametypes and after 30 seconds I would beat the secondary account with my main, either by killing it or capturing the base. I would do this until my main account was 4 levels higher than my secondary i.e. main=5 secondary=1. It takes about 2-3 hours to get your main four levels higher than your secondary. At this point, I would then setup a team territory ranked match, siege, no respawns and with helicopters on. I would have my main account signed in as the second player and the secondary signed in as the first player. I would then start the game up, this method results in the helicopter killing your main account and basically switches the rank back the opposite way, so eventually your accounts look like this i.e main=1 secondary=5.

Yep, using Auto-Pilot for the team matches, and anything in solo for solo matches is right on. Personally, I use Solo Territory with base location = central and victory at 5 points. This way no matter how many accounts I have in the room, all I have to do is walk up and hold the base for 5 seconds to win. On Boneyard, the base is the cargo plane in the middle of the map. I'm currently in the 30's and it seems like I am gaining 2-3 spots on the leaderboard for every 3-4 hours I am playing solo.

dakisbac 01-23-2010 05:24 PM

Now that the guide is completed, I'd like you to prove to me why/how matches ending within the first 30 seconds do no not count. It is my opinion that those matches DO count, since I saw the change on the leaderboard after the game, but that doing those games will cause a lag out often.

NeoGeo18 01-23-2010 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCSS Aerocoupe (Post 2724491)
Yep, using Auto-Pilot for the team matches, and anything in solo for solo matches is right on. Personally, I use Solo Territory with base location = central and victory at 5 points. This way no matter how many accounts I have in the room, all I have to do is walk up and hold the base for 5 seconds to win. On Boneyard, the base is the cargo plane in the middle of the map. I'm currently in the 30's and it seems like I am gaining 2-3 spots on the leaderboard for every 3-4 hours I am playing solo.

Yeah, the only reason I suggested using solo elim was that using this gametype you could work on other achievements, i.e sniper, heavyweight. You can still do this in solo objective though. I guess I just changed it around due to boredom.

Just as a little heads up when you get upto about 15th in the solo boards you will only be moving 1 spot every 3-4 hours and in some cases I had to play 10+ hours to pass some accounts. You should get it pretty quick once you've reached around 3rd.

NeoGeo18 01-23-2010 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dakisbac (Post 2724775)
Now that the guide is completed, I'd like you to prove to me why/how matches ending within the first 30 seconds do no not count. It is my opinion that those matches DO count, since I saw the change on the leaderboard after the game, but that doing those games will cause a lag out often.

To be honest I think that those games used to count, but no longer do since ubisoft's last leaderboard refresh. I also have to have the 10 second game start timer on otherwise my game's don't count, I know that this isn't the case for everyone.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-23-2010 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dakisbac (Post 2724775)
Now that the guide is completed, I'd like you to prove to me why/how matches ending within the first 30 seconds do no not count. It is my opinion that those matches DO count, since I saw the change on the leaderboard after the game, but that doing those games will cause a lag out often.

Well, have you ever considered the fact that there may have been a delay in the leaderboard getting updated? If you ended a match and exited out and checked the leaderboard within say 5 seconds, and it took 10 seconds for the leaderboard to update, then you would not see the change until after the next match.

And are you saying that ending rounds in under 30 seconds over and over will cause the match to lag out? Then why would you want to do it? Saving a few seconds per round at the risk of the game crashing and having to set it back up?

With 2v2 matches if one of the two losing accounts dies by the helicopter before 30 seconds a lot, then you will see that account not drop as fast on the leaderboard. I have seen that happen a lot and the losing team may start at positions #110 and #111 and if the account that started at #111 gets killed within the first 30 seconds several times the other account will drop below it. The only way that can happen is if when the one account died within the first 30 seconds then the loss in that round did not count against it.

But feel free to spend 2 or 3 hours winning (or losing) every single round within the first 20 seconds. If those matches count, then you should climb (or drop) at least 2 ranks in that time. But be sure EVERY round ends within 20 seconds. If you are right and the 30 second rule does not exist, then there is no reason rounds ending within 20 seconds should not count. Let me know how that goes...

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-24-2010 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dakisbac (Post 2724775)
...I'd like you to prove to me why/how matches ending within the first 30 seconds do no not count. It is my opinion that those matches DO count, since I saw the change on the leaderboard after the game...

I stumbled on proof last night of a delay in the leaderboard. I was ranking up in solo in a 1v2 match. Both of my dummy accounts dropped from rank 19's down to a rank 18 after the same round, so i decided that I would take a look at the leaderboard. The leaderboard said they were still rank 19's. Now if the change would have been a spot on the leaderboard instead of an actual rank AND I would have gone back and played a couple rounds back-to-back and ended them in under 30 seconds and gone back to the leaderboard to see the change, then I would start to believe the 30 second rule does not exist. But that was not the case.

I witnessed a delay in the leaderboard reflecting results from a round. Therefore ending one or two rounds in under 30 seconds and seeing a change on the leaderboard does not prove the 30 second rule does not exist. But, again, feel free to start a match and end EVERY round in 20 seconds or less and let us know how fast you rank up or down doing that.

dakisbac 01-25-2010 09:14 PM

I know there's a delay, but that doesn't prove anything. And before we go any further, realise that I do know what I'm talking about, having completed this game two years ago. What I'm saying is that I saw firsthand that you do move up the leaderboards even if the match ends before 30 seconds.

As for your comment about lagging out, the only time you don't want that happening is when the game is playing itself. But if you pick a big map then it will take the heli longer than 30 seconds to kill the other guy anyway, so it's not a problem. If it happens when you're actually playing (solo matches) then it's not really a problem- especially not for me since I checked the leaderboard after every game.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-26-2010 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dakisbac (Post 2730273)
I know there's a delay, but that doesn't prove anything. And before we go any further, realise that I do know what I'm talking about, having completed this game two years ago. What I'm saying is that I saw firsthand that you do move up the leaderboards even if the match ends before 30 seconds.

As for your comment about lagging out, the only time you don't want that happening is when the game is playing itself. But if you pick a big map then it will take the heli longer than 30 seconds to kill the other guy anyway, so it's not a problem. If it happens when you're actually playing (solo matches) then it's not really a problem- especially not for me since I checked the leaderboard after every game.

I must be missing something here in your question, logic, or something... Having proof that there is (at least sometimes) a delay in the leaderboard getting updating has no effect on your theory that rounds under 30 seconds long count, because you saw the change after a round that was under 30 seconds long? Or are you saying that when you did this a couple years ago, you did end every match in under 30 seconds and you were still ranking up?

Just how short of a round are you talking about? And how often would it lag out? By the time you recreate the room and change the max number of players down one to equal the number of accounts you are using (to prevent a random person from joining), you've already spent at least 10 seconds recreating the room. Plus the more times you create the room, the higher the chance you will screw up on one of the settings and then if you fall asleep, you just lost a couple hours worth of work as it runs on auto-pilot.

For a map, I always use Boneyard. There is about a 10% chance the helo will take out one of the loser accounts within the first 30 seconds. But there is about a 75% the match will go flawlessly and take less than 2 minutes.

dakisbac 01-26-2010 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCSS Aerocoupe (Post 2731959)
I must be missing something here in your question, logic, or something... Having proof that there is (at least sometimes) a delay in the leaderboard getting updating has no effect on your theory that rounds under 30 seconds long count, because you saw the change after a round that was under 30 seconds long? Or are you saying that when you did this a couple years ago, you did end every match in under 30 seconds and you were still ranking up?

What I meant was that your witnessing the leaderboard delay has no connection to matches <30 seconds.

Quote:

Just how short of a round are you talking about? And how often would it lag out? By the time you recreate the room and change the max number of players down one to equal the number of accounts you are using (to prevent a random person from joining), you've already spent at least 10 seconds recreating the room. Plus the more times you create the room, the higher the chance you will screw up on one of the settings and then if you fall asleep, you just lost a couple hours worth of work as it runs on auto-pilot.

For a map, I always use Boneyard. There is about a 10% chance the helo will take out one of the loser accounts within the first 30 seconds. But there is about a 75% the match will go flawlessly and take less than 2 minutes.
When playing (solo) I also played on Boneyard, and consistently killed the other player within 10 seconds. I still ranked up, which is why I know they count. When I refer to lag out, I mean after the match ends where it kicks you to the main multiplayer screen before you can relaunch. Ending the match within 10 seconds caused that to happen a lot, but like I said, even if I didn't lag out I always backed out to check the leaderboard anyway so it didn't matter. Another reason why it wouldn't matter is because I'm right there to set the game up again.

When the game was playing itself (team) I played on Nowhere. It took about a minute average for the match to end, which is good because it's a quick match yet long enough to avoid a lag out (which would cause a loss of hours).

Anyway, I didn't mean to start an argument. I was just correcting you saying that matches <30 seconds DO count, but otherwise you did a good job with the guide. Like I said before, it saves me the trouble of writing one

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-26-2010 09:41 PM

I understand now. I was under the impression you did it once or twice and saw the change, hence the reason I was saying it was probably due to a delay on the leaderboard updating.

I don't think this still works due to an update Ubisoft released for GRAW, but I'll devote an hour tonight to doing it this way to see if it still works. I've been ranking up in solo one full rank about every 20-30 minutes then deranking in team on auto-pilot overnight so I am at the same spot the next time I go to rank up again. If I get a good 2.5 - 3 hour session in, I can go from a rank 15 to a high 20 or even a low 21. So waiting 30 seconds results in about 2-3 ranks per hour, I will see how this stacks up tonight.

I've had matches run for over 18 hours straight on Boneyard, doing Alternating on Auto-Pilot with no lag outs, so worries on that map.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-27-2010 03:17 AM

Aero reports, you decide.

Played over 25 minutes of rounds ending in 20-25 seconds, with 1-2 rounds going over 30 seconds as I got distracted. But for about 95% of the rounds I entered the capture zone after 11 seconds, victory was at 16 seconds, and the rounds ends at 21 seconds. So approximately 50 rounds over the course of 25+ minutes. I moved from spot #310 to #299.

Then I played exactly 5 rounds that I entered the capture zone after 31 seconds, victory of 36 seconds and round ends at 41 seconds. In that time, I moved from #299 to #281.

Up 11 spots in 25 minutes vs 18 spots in 5 minutes. I think the data speaks for itself.

dakisbac 01-27-2010 05:58 AM

So basically, I was right that quick matches count. Unfortunately we cannot conclude with what you're getting at- which is that waiting 30 seconds works better/faster. As you yourself stated, you can pass some people in one or two games, and others it will take quite a long time. For example, I'm still ranked in the teens on the Team board, which means the hardest people to pass are now in the mid twenties. It would take someone hours to go from, say, position 25 to 24, but when they got to my position, say position 16, it would only take one more game to pass me. And that will be the same no matter how long the match is.

MCSS Aerocoupe 01-27-2010 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dakisbac (Post 2733937)
So basically, I was right that quick matches count. Unfortunately we cannot conclude with what you're getting at- which is that waiting 30 seconds works better/faster. As you yourself stated, you can pass some people in one or two games, and others it will take quite a long time. For example, I'm still ranked in the teens on the Team board, which means the hardest people to pass are now in the mid twenties. It would take someone hours to go from, say, position 25 to 24, but when they got to my position, say position 16, it would only take one more game to pass me. And that will be the same no matter how long the match is.

Not necessarily, if you read my post again, you will notice "1-2 rounds going over 30 seconds as I got distracted". So i did make some progress from those rounds. And, as I said before, I have been going from a rank 15 to a high 20/low 21 in solo in the evening then deranking back to a 15 overnight in team and repeating the process each day for the last couple of weeks. So I know how long it takes to go up where I am right now. 20 minutes will give me a full rank in the Rank 15-16 range, Rank 17 takes a minute or two more and Rank 18 takes about 30 minutes. I was a mid Rank 15 and did not make 1/2 of a rank in over 25 minutes, but the last 15 times I started at that point I made it up to a Rank 16 in 20 minutes. So you tell me, why is it that when doing quick rounds I failed to make anywhere near the progress in 25 minutes as I have made in 20 minutes the previous 15 times I was in the exact same spot?

And, aside from Rank 25 when did I say it takes different amounts of time to pass different people?

For me, it is case closed, there is no benifit to doing quick rounds. Two or three years ago it may have worked flawlessly, but currently doing short rounds serves no purpose. Anyone going for the leaderboard achievements can try it if they want, but I will not recommend it due to the results I saw last night, and I will not do it again.

dakisbac 01-28-2010 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCSS Aerocoupe (Post 2734341)
And, aside from Rank 25 when did I say it takes different amounts of time to pass different people?

For me, it is case closed, there is no benifit to doing quick rounds. Two or three years ago it may have worked flawlessly, but currently doing short rounds serves no purpose. Anyone going for the leaderboard achievements can try it if they want, but I will not recommend it due to the results I saw last night, and I will not do it again.

Sorry, you didn't. I thought you did when you were talking about the level breakdown, but that was just me throwing it out there. That can't happen on the universal board due to ranking matter, but on the team/solo board if you get to rank 1 then keep playing you increase your distance forever. Therefore people behind might go from rank 3 to rank 2 in a few games, but then to pass you they have to play all the additional games you played, plus one.

Either way, I'm done here. I sought out just to clarify once and for all that short matches DO count and you've done so. The fact that it's slower surprises me, but as you suggested all the time between my playing and now something could've changed.

NeoGeo18 01-28-2010 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dakisbac (Post 2735375)
Sorry, you didn't. I thought you did when you were talking about the level breakdown, but that was just me throwing it out there. That can't happen on the universal board due to ranking matter, but on the team/solo board if you get to rank 1 then keep playing you increase your distance forever. Therefore people behind might go from rank 3 to rank 2 in a few games, but then to pass you they have to play all the additional games you played, plus one.

Either way, I'm done here. I sought out just to clarify once and for all that short matches DO count and you've done so. The fact that it's slower surprises me, but as you suggested all the time between my playing and now something could've changed.

I can't believe your being so narrow minded, both me and aercoupe have explained to you why we believe matches under 30 seconds no longer count and aerocoupe has even tested your theory, although not conclusively enough. You are blindy stating that matches under 30 seconds do count based on your experience on this game 2 years ago. I and around 10 others I know who have played this game within the last six months, have all agreed that matches only count after 30 seconds. Please stop being so ignorant and test your theory now before saying something that could waste several hours of people's time.

iTz ArMS 02-06-2010 09:37 PM

Yeah!
 
Yeah you tell 'em Geo!
Ehm well this achievement shouldn't take too long if you get the right help or if the guy on top helps the next person by leaving his console running for a bit.
However it would only apply to those in the top 10 or 20 maybe something like that for the no.1 to help them cause no point helpin someone who may never make it...

onemorechanc 02-17-2010 03:03 PM

Disclaimer -- I have not yet played this game, so this question will probably seem silly. I may attempt this in the near future, but want to prepare for it first.

I assume that if I let the game "play itself" for a few hours, each account needs a separate controller. My question is this -- what happens if a controller shuts off/runs out of battery power during this? Does the game pause/stop? If I were to run this for a few hours at a time, would it be necessary to baby-sit it or use a wired controller?


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