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-   -   Do You Invert The Y-Axis? (http://www.xboxachievements.com/forum/showthread.php?t=298094)

Xscapist 03-05-2011 07:06 AM

Do You Invert The Y-Axis?
 
Gamers who invert the y-axis on camera controls are technically the minority, but not an insignificant one. I've seen it said that it's maybe between 1 in 4 or 1 in 3 who play inverted.

I'm one of those people who was really thrown off by the game's lack of proper inverted controls (it's either "normal," or *both* axis are inverted, which is even worse). Personally, I blame Goldeneye for this. And maybe StarFox (I needed to quickly change to inverted every time I was required to pilot the Beluga, because I just couldn't do it otherwise). In discussions I've noticed that its typically older gamers who invert more often, because of games like those, but what can you do.

I'm curious how many other people here playing BG&E similarly struggled the way I did with the game, so I figured why not start a poll? And out of curiosity, I'm going to include additional options to try and get a sense of the generational thing as well (since what era have you been gaming?).

P.S.: I did just 100% the game, btw. But I had to try my hardest to avoid adjusting the camera up or down. The way camera is handled during the whole Slaughterhouse chapter was particularly tough.

P.P.S.: Anyone who posts just to say people who play inverted should "stop whining" are not contributing anything useful to the discussion.

Sharpy Snow 03-05-2011 12:51 PM

I honestly don't see what the fuss is all about.

Is it really that difficult to just get used to the camera after a couple of goes with it? I don't say this in a mean spirited way mind, but out of somewhat curiosity as I'll often end up changing between games with similar and yet different control schemes, but give me a minute or two to remember the layout, I'll have adapted to it again.

I just don't see how 30 or 40 pictures into the game, people are still struggling to handle an up and down motion. Sorry. =/

Diachron 03-05-2011 01:24 PM

I invert to the point of having my Y-axis inverted by default on my Xbox game default settings. The only problem with that is that when a game still doesn't control as I expect, I don't know if it's ignoring my setting, or naturally aligned to my tendency.

I've been gaming for a thousand years, so it may be an age thing.

Dannyb0yUK 03-05-2011 02:03 PM

I always have my console games Y axis inverted and as per the OP, I do believe it was the N64 that started it all. As soon as I read what was said about Goldeneye and Lylat Wars, I started to recall my first times playing them and having trouble getting acquainted with it- but now? Now I just find 'normal' to be just 'bleurghhh' lol!

I'm not a regular PC gamer, but when I do play I have to have my mouse set to normal though. I can't get my head around how that works, but inverted feels just as odd on a mouse.

As far as the X axis goes, I can only deal with it when it's the reverse of however it's set by default in BG&E. I got through the game, just like I did the first time around- it just would have enhanced the experience that little bit more if the camera control had felt 'right'.

The Destroyernatorer 03-05-2011 02:14 PM

I always invert, so this game is really messing with my head, because if you invert the Y it also inverts the x. No one I've met ever inverts x and y, just y.

So I'm left trying to work out if having no invert or having an extra axis inverted is better for me. I figure you turn left and right more than you look up and down, so I'm going for the non-invert. I still keep looking down when I want to look up though.

And for those who don't use invert, getting used to not using it isn't like just playing with a different layout. It's ingrained into my brain, and I can't just flick a switch.

Xscapist 03-05-2011 03:52 PM

Right, it's different with control layouts, because almost every game has a slightly different control layout...there's no "default" set of controls that the majority of games all use, but in the early days of 3D and FPS, inverted was default (in fact, in some early games what is now considered "normal" y-axis was labeled "inverted"). And it's difficult to just unlearn the way you've been playing games for the last 15 years (or more).

Hollow_Six 03-05-2011 04:25 PM

I've always played inverted. It's not like a control layout switch as simple b does something different but more like a muscle memory. To understand play a shooter a lot and then switch to inverted. Maybe it's just years of playing but in my experience whenever my friends take the controls they get all confused as they are used to using the now normal control scheme.

jgahagan 03-06-2011 01:05 PM

I've played inverted for as long as I can remember and I bought BG&E when it first came out for my PS2. I must have completely forgotten about the camera 'issues' because when I re-bought the HD version I was completely thrown off by the inverted option! I've personally found it's not a big problem until it comes to combat, THEN it's a problem.

Also has anyone tried playing that pearl game Mdisk you get for collecting all pearls? Jesus, try playing that with inverted controls!

TheDeadspace 03-06-2011 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jgahagan (Post 4052073)
I've played inverted for as long as I can remember and I bought BG&E when it first came out for my PS2. I must have completely forgotten about the camera 'issues' because when I re-bought the HD version I was completely thrown off by the inverted option! I've personally found it's not a big problem until it comes to combat, THEN it's a problem.

Also has anyone tried playing that pearl game Mdisk you get for collecting all pearls? Jesus, try playing that with inverted controls!

First part is exactly how I was. I remember loving the game on Xbox, but couldn't for the life of me remember the camera controls being such a pain.

And shit, is that the reason Yo! Pearl is so hard? May give it another try with "normal" controls then.

TakahashiDemon 03-06-2011 03:49 PM

Found everything easy enough using normal controls..

Cygnes 03-06-2011 09:47 PM

I need things inverted. Iono why, just do. I find it difficult if i have to compensate for normal controls as it takes extra time. No way I could play a shooter where it requires twitchy movement but something like this I can make do. I played this the first time around and managed it. I sposse I'll have to do it again. Its a damn fine game and wholly worth the extra effort involved.

We need a support group ;)
Enjoy,
-Cyg

jgahagan 03-06-2011 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDeadspace (Post 4052168)
And shit, is that the reason Yo! Pearl is so hard? May give it another try with "normal" controls then.

I swear it is, I may have just been so confused by this whole inverted malarky though!

pacokorn77 03-07-2011 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xscapist (Post 4049285)
Personally, I blame Goldeneye for this. And maybe StarFox (I needed to quickly change to inverted every time I was required to pilot the Beluga, because I just couldn't do it otherwise).

Actually, I blame both. StarFox is what started it, but I was playing both games during the same summer. I can't play any game without the Y-axis inverted.

X-axis can vary from game to game, but most part, the X-axis stays normal.

Metalik 03-07-2011 01:29 PM

I hate to play with inverted axis! But with Beluga it works pretty well! :D (Cuz inversion+inversion=no inversion!)

Ryuukishi 03-07-2011 04:36 PM

I won't purchase the game until they patch this. I absolutely need the Y axis inverted, that is non negotiable. I'm sure I could take some time and get used to the inverted X axis as well (Final Fantasy XII played that way, and it's my second favorite game of all time, along with a bunch of other PS2 and GameCube games that I played with an inverted X axis) but why should I have to. I have plenty of other games to play that I don't have to work to enjoy. This would be such a simple thing for them to patch in.

NexT2010 03-08-2011 05:24 PM

For this game i set everything on normal. But on most games I do set it on inverted.

Chuppernicus 03-09-2011 03:34 AM

Always normal.
What 8 bit games let you invert axis?
I play many types of games at once and often find I'm pushing, pressing, squeezing something wrong based on the game played previously, but I adapt. Doesn't really bother me much.

Xscapist 03-09-2011 04:44 PM

The second part of the question is how long you've been gaming, not how long you've been inverting.

ZoSomma 03-10-2011 07:41 PM

Been inverting ever since I spent the better part of 4 years of my life playing the X-Wing/TIE Fighter series on PC. At least that's my theory...flight sims hardwired my brain for the Y-axis inversion. I haven't worked my theory out enough to figure how or why it would carry over to console F/TPS's though.

But yeah...I ended up having to invert everything for this game which then completely screwed me up for the first 10 minutes or so of Dead Space 2. Was running left into walls when I wanted to go right around a corner. And god forbid there was a door...I probably couldn't have gotten through it on the first attempt if it was 30 feet wide. It was a complete mess but it was worth it to play through BG&E again.

Magnet 03-11-2011 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuppernicus (Post 4058954)
Always normal.
What 8 bit games let you invert axis?
I play many types of games at once and often find I'm pushing, pressing, squeezing something wrong based on the game played previously, but I adapt. Doesn't really bother me much.

I had a flight simulator on my Tandy 1000 (came out in 1984). I started playing inverted then. In that situation, you push the up key to dive forward, and down to pull back, right to roll right and left to roll left. In first person games this same feel translated over. The inverted Y axis has the same feel, although pushing right or left doesn't roll you in first person, the general idea of rolling the plane was to eventually go in that direction so that's the rational I make.

You learn to do something a particular way and your brain physically changes to learn that way. For many of us, that change has been ingrained for so long it would be like asking somebody who's right handed to start using their left hand instead. Sure they can write left handed, but it's not going to be pretty without a bit of practice. Same with inverted people.

venom077 03-12-2011 02:51 AM

Great to see most real gamers invert there controls. All my friends play non inverted and I just don't see how they do it. It just seems unnatural to me.

Deadly Moves 03-12-2011 04:38 PM

I have never inverted my controls. Andi dont why people would. Why push up to look down and left to look right? Unless its a flight sim, thats just pain retarded...lol

Dannyb0yUK 03-17-2011 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuppernicus (Post 4058954)
Always normal.
What 8 bit games let you invert axis?
I play many types of games at once and often find I'm pushing, pressing, squeezing something wrong based on the game played previously, but I adapt. Doesn't really bother me much.

Another stupid example. Unless of course I'm forgetting all those first and third person perspective games of the 8 bit generation which featured camera controls.

gabwe 03-18-2011 03:10 AM

I always invert too, so I'm struggling with the controls on this game... :(

xxJUSTINxx 03-20-2011 03:52 AM

Holy crap, when I first started flying the ship. I had so much trouble, LOL I had to kill that thing also. So it was all weird.

DarkReign2021 03-24-2011 07:31 PM

I can play either way, but if possible I always switch the Y-Axis to inverted (and all third-person games I invert the X-Axis as well.)

I'm only 21, but I started gaming back on the Atari 2600. Didn't start inverting until 2003 though. I played default Halo: CE for 2 years, but one day at a party I was stuck on a profile that was inverted and didn't have a chance to change it. After that, I've been an invert gamer ever sine.

the bears beard 07-15-2011 10:42 AM

I only really invert for flying games/levels. I used to invert for the Halo franchise and timesplitters but one day my brain decided I couldn't do it any more!

PoMoGub 09-29-2011 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by venom077 (Post 4067300)
Great to see most real gamers invert there controls. All my friends play non inverted and I just don't see how they do it. It just seems unnatural to me.

How do you figure most "real gamers" invert from a few posts on a forum? Gamers who invert are very much the minority. Hell, you even gave a sample audience that directly disproves your misguided claims.

Sygness 10-21-2011 01:59 PM

Funny to see more people who're struggling with the controls for this game. I played this game on gamecube before, and don't remember it being a problem back then, but then again, I don't remember inverting the y-axis either. I don't know when I started doing that, or what game I played that engrained this into my brain. But it is now, and not being able to have the x-axis on normal while y is inverted turned fun into frustration for at least the first hour of this game, and frankly made me set it aside for a while to get to playing a game which controls aren't in the way for me. Which is a shame, because this is a great game.

SmarmySmurf 11-25-2011 08:56 AM

http://gamepeople.wordpress.com/2006/11/07/down-is-up/ sums it up nice, I think. It's just what's more intuitive for you. I have yet to get this, but i'm tempted for the cyber monday sale... yet the controls in the demo were extremely off-putting. And unlike Silent Hill Homecoming, I'm not in love enough with the design/genre enough to just put up with it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoMoGub (Post 4539875)
How do you figure most "real gamers" invert from a few posts on a forum? Gamers who invert are very much the minority. Hell, you even gave a sample audience that directly disproves your misguided claims.

Because every poll on every forum like this ever has the same results. A 2:1 result in favor of inverting the Y axis. Sure, that ignores all the casuals who never post of game forums. if only the other poster could have been more clear, like by using the word "real" to clarify what type of gamers he meant...


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