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Multiplayer Achievements Confirmed


bryson 06
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I'm honestly surprised Spec Ops: The Line didn't have any MP ones regardless of how literally tacked-on/contractually obligated it was.

 

I think that was the point behind no achievements for it. The developers wanted to do it less the the consumers wanted it. Thus, it was bolted on with very little development put into it simply to 'tick a box'. The developers themselves said it was 'cancerous garbage' and said not to play it and that they were sorry they had to include it.

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I think you may have read my post in a different way, so I will explain to you what I meant.

 

My point was if there were no MP achievements for this game then not many people would even bother playing this tacked on MP at all. It's understandable and almost compulsory for games like Halo and Battlefield to have them. But Tomb Raider? No.

 

It personally doesn't change my feelings and potentially how much I will or will not enjoy the single player portion of the game when it's released. But I can't help but feel the developers in this case have purposely created a list of grinding achievements just so people have an excuse to want to put in the hours to even play it in the first place.

 

Do you see what I'm trying to say here?

 

I know what you were trying to say, and you're just assuming that they've just tacked on MP and put achievements on it as an excuse to play it, yet you don't know that at all for a fact. Maybe they actually think it will work, and people will like it. That's how games with MP are formed to begin with. Nobody ever knows whether their MP will work or not, that's why they have to TRY.

 

When the game comes out and ends up being nothing special, then you can say that they most likely tacked it on.

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I know what you were trying to say, and you're just assuming that they've just tacked on MP and put achievements on it as an excuse to play it, yet you don't know that at all for a fact. Maybe they actually think it will work, and people will like it. That's how games with MP are formed to begin with. Nobody ever knows whether their MP will work or not, that's why they have to TRY.

 

When the game comes out and ends up being nothing special, then you can say that they most likely tacked it on.

 

It's no mystery that they added it in to purely extend the game's overall market value, and the MP achievements (while an assumption) does at least ensure they have the statistics to say people actually play their game online. If the MP actually looked decent there probably wouldn't be half as many complaints. It doesn't. It looks like a bolted on pile of shit.Minimal effort, maximum return.

 

Yes, no one if forcing anyone to play the MP. But imagine the resources that could have gone into creating a better and more fun SP experience instead draining them into producing something that is not needed and something they knew people were going to be resistant towards in the first place.

What are you most looking forward to about the MP from what you have seen? What part of it doesn't look tacked on to you? MP is not needed in Tomb Raider. Watch them add DLC map packs later on.

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This isn't confirmation of MP achievement at all.

At 3:55 you see the player plant a snare, when they go back up the stairs you can see a player crouched over and undoing themselves.

I'm assuming Entrapment just requires snaring an enemy. This sounds like it could easily be unlocked in both SP and MP.

 

good call bro....

 

http://www.xbox360achievements.org/game/tomb-raider-9/achievements/

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Alright NOW we know that mp achievements are confirmed, and there are several, including a max level one, weak

 

14 for 250g

 

 

game looks cool, but these achievements have just made my decision for me...

 

it's clear that the dev doesn't care about the player... they make these achievements as a gimmick for people to play their mp...

 

makes no sense as this is a single player game that is supposed to have a rich single player mode...

 

oh well 60 bucks for me to spend on another dev...

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It's no mystery that they added it in to purely extend the game's overall market value, and the MP achievements (while an assumption) does at least ensure they have the statistics to say people actually play their game online. If the MP actually looked decent there probably wouldn't be half as many complaints. It doesn't. It looks like a bolted on pile of shit.Minimal effort, maximum return.

 

Wow, don't even know where to begin. No shit that's what MP is for, to extend the time you play the game. That is the purpose of MP, and it always has been. Do you think people would've played nearly as much time as they have with Goldeneye, Halo, COD, almost any fighter, if it did not have MP? Nope, they wouldn't have, and that's why MP is there.

 

'If the MP was decent then wouldn't be half as many complaints?' Really? Then why do all the complaints pretty much say 'OMG, they're trying to get the COD audience. MP does not belong in Tomb Raider. OMG, I hate MP achievements.' None of those are general criticisms of the mode itself, and what could be used to improve it.

 

Yes, no one if forcing anyone to play the MP. But imagine the resources that could have gone into creating a better and more fun SP experience instead draining them into producing something that is not needed and something they knew people were going to be resistant towards in the first place.

 

Once again, this is just a big assumption. How do you know for a fact that the SP portion of the game would be better if it did not have MP? MP was introduced in the Uncharted franchise, and that didn't take anything away from the SP part of the game, so why should this? MP in other series didn't take away from the SP portion as well, so once again, why should this?

 

What are you most looking forward to about the MP from what you have seen? What part of it doesn't look tacked on to you? MP is not needed in Tomb Raider. Watch them add DLC map packs later on.

 

First off (another assumption) I never said I was looking forward to this MP. All I'm saying is that complaining about it and the MP achievements, when you don't even have to bother with them to begin with, is completely pointless. I didn't much care for Dead Space 2s multiplayer, so after trying it, I stopped playing it. I didn't stop me from enjoying the game at all. Why should it being any different for this game?

 

From what I've seen from the multiplayer, it looks a lot like Uncharteds', which could end up being good, as people have enjoyed that MP. Kind of hard to actually say how it will end up being, as the game is not out yet, but that hasn't stopped people from throwing out assumptions before.

 

Who are you to dictate what developers should put into their games? A lot of developers have had their games get a lot of popularity due to having MP included. Imagine if people told Bungie to not put MP into the Halo series. Would the series have become as popular as it has? Nope, not even close.

 

When the game comes out, and the mode actually ends up not being that good, then people voice their displeasure about it, then they most likely won't include it again. However, I don't see what the problem is with them trying something out first.

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Wow, don't even know where to begin. No shit that's what MP is for, to extend the time you play the game. That is the purpose of MP, and it always has been. Do you think people would've played nearly as much time as they have with Goldeneye, Halo, COD, almost any fighter, if it did not have MP? Nope, they wouldn't have, and that's why MP is there.

Except shooters and fighters have pretty much essentially always required some form of MP. Back in the day, going to the arcade and playing Street Fighter or Mortal Kombat or whatever other fighter they had, you almost always played against another person and not the AI (unless nobody else was around). With shooters, people have always wanted to play with/against their friends/other people, and not some AI that acts in predetermined manners. So it's the nature of those games that MP would be included, not as something added solely to extend the game's life.

 

TR though has always been a story-based, single-player franchise, where you're doing your thing alone; Lara doesn't have squadmates. Nowhere in the franchise can one look and say "This would be so much better if I could play this with/against someone!" That's why MP here has the appearance of being tacked on just to extend the game's life -- it certainly wasn't because it was a natural inclusion.

 

Also, there has been plenty of complaining about how the MP looks boring/uninspired/just an Uncharted wannabe. If there wasn't, there'd not be so much talk of having to grind thru the levels (if it looked enjoyable, it wouldn't be a grind).

Edited by jswartz0181
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Except shooters and fighters have pretty much essentially always required some form of MP. Back in the day, going to the arcade and playing Street Fighter or Mortal Kombat or whatever other fighter they had, you almost always played against another person and not the AI (unless nobody else was around). With shooters, people have always wanted to play with/against their friends/other people, and not some AI that acts in predetermined manners. So it's the nature of those games that MP would be included, not as something added solely to extend the game's life.

 

That's not entirely true. There have been shooters that do not have MP and ended up doing well, half-life being a good example. Also, what you don't understand is that is still exactly why MP is used, to extend the games' life. Most shooters and fighters would not be played nearly as much without the inclusion of MP, hence why it extends their life, and it is why people still play those games today.

 

TR though has always been a story-based, single-player franchise, where you're doing your thing alone; Lara doesn't have squadmates. Nowhere in the franchise can one look and say "This would be so much better if I could play this with/against someone!" That's why MP here has the appearance of being tacked on just to extend the game's life -- it certainly wasn't because it was a natural inclusion.

 

Once again, another assumption. I highly doubt the developers looked at it and went 'oh look lets add some MP and make some more money off of it.' Firstly, nothing really shows that for a fact, they will make more money off of adding in MP. If anything, they might lose some money due to people whining and crying about it. So, why take that risk? It's probably because they think that people might like it.

 

I don't remember people wanting MP in Uncharted, yet that didn't stop them from adding it in, and becoming a hit with it. Why shouldn't the developers of Tomb Raider want to see if the same thing can happen with them?

 

Also, there has been plenty of complaining about how the MP looks boring/uninspired/just an Uncharted wannabe. If there wasn't, there'd not be so much talk of having to grind thru the levels (if it looked enjoyable, it wouldn't be a grind).

 

First off, I don't see what's wrong with being an Uncharted wanna be. The game is a huge hit, and the MP has worked. I don't see what's so wrong about it being pushed over to more audiences, seeing as how that game will never be on the 360.

 

What you also said here proved my point. 'If it looked enjoyable, it wouldn't be a grind.' Okay then, why do you suggest to make it enjoyable? Yet all I hear is 'OMG, MP does not belong in Tomb Raider. Fuck MP achievements in Tomb Raider.' Those are not valid criticisms on how to improve the mode. If there were valid criticisms and suggestions on improving the mode, that would be different, yet they don't seem to exist.

 

Also, what needs to be a grind? It doesn't need to be, because it's an entirely optional mode that does not need to be touched at all. That's what people don't seem to understand.

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Wow, don't even know where to begin. No shit that's what MP is for, to extend the time you play the game. That is the purpose of MP, and it always has been. Do you think people would've played nearly as much time as they have with Goldeneye, Halo, COD, almost any fighter, if it did not have MP? Nope, they wouldn't have, and that's why MP is there.

 

Yeah, but that's because COD, Goldeneye, Halo, being FPS, are better suited to a MP experience and are practically self explanatory. What do people normally associate Tomb Raider with? Hours of exploration in the single player, not gunning each other down in team deathmatch. There was no obvious demand for a MP unlike the games listed there.

 

There's a difference between trying something new and adding something that just doesn't belong.

 

'If the MP was decent then wouldn't be half as many complaints?' Really? Then why do all the complaints pretty much say 'OMG, they're trying to get the COD audience. MP does not belong in Tomb Raider. OMG, I hate MP achievements.' None of those are general criticisms of the mode itself, and what could be used to improve it.

 

I take it you've only been reading the complaints on the comments section on the main page? From what I've seen everywhere else, aside from that, most of the complaints have been geared toward the terrible hit-detection, only three game modes, five small ass maps and only 4v4 max players. Are these not valid complaints for some to voice their concerns?

 

Why are they are giving gamers a reason to attach any bad flack to the re-boot because of a lousy MP experience if it isn't up to scratch? If it hurts the game's reputation, it hurts the game's reputation.

 

Once again, this is just a big assumption. How do you know for a fact that the SP portion of the game would be better if it did not have MP? MP was introduced in the Uncharted franchise, and that didn't take anything away from the SP part of the game, so why should this? MP in other series didn't take away from the SP portion as well, so once again, why should this?

 

My point was, resources that could have gone into single player experience have been siphoned away to develop the MP. That is my main concern here because I'm most looking forward that more than anything. I want the best single player experience possible with no shortcomings and no "if only they put more time into this" like-scenarios.

 

First off (another assumption) I never said I was looking forward to this MP. All I'm saying is that complaining about it and the MP achievements, when you don't even have to bother with them to begin with, is completely pointless. I didn't much care for Dead Space 2s multiplayer, so after trying it, I stopped playing it. I didn't stop me from enjoying the game at all. Why should it being any different for this game?

 

Yeah, but try saying that to someone else who takes achievements and completion very seriously. From their perspective, adding achievements for something that's supposed to be "optional" is like adding insult to injury for some because they feel like they're forced to play something they won't enjoy if they want to complete the game. That's the only way I can put it, really.

 

From what I've seen from the multiplayer, it looks a lot like Uncharted's, which could end up being good, as people have enjoyed that MP. Kind of hard to actually say how it will end up being, as the game is not out yet, but that hasn't stopped people from throwing out assumptions before.

 

Just because it looks like Uncharted, doesn't mean it will be as successful or play as well. At least the developers of Uncharted seemed to have put in a lot into the thinking process for implementing a MP, not just some half ass attempt. Uncharted 3 was far more ambitious with co-operative and competitive MP and had more than just three game modes. Tomb Raider's MP doesn't. It looks so tacked on it's as clear as day. That's what I'm trying to get at.

 

Who are you to dictate what developers should put into their games? A lot of developers have had their games get a lot of popularity due to having MP included. Imagine if people told Bungie to not put MP into the Halo series. Would the series have become as popular as it has? Nope, not even close.

 

First off, I'm not dictating anything, Celtic. Secondly, I'm simply voicing my own view on what looks, to me, a tacked on, half assed attempt at including a MP mode into the franchise.

 

And Bungie were practically begged to include a competitive MP after the first Halo game. Again, it's almost self-explanatory for a FPS to include a MP in this day and age. What works in one genre doesn't equate to success and word wide approval in another. Nor does it ensure the online community will be as active either. How many people play, say, The Darkness online compared to your CODs, Halos and Battlefields?

 

Tomb Raider was already a household name with a big following without MP even before those games ever existed,

 

When the game comes out, and the mode actually ends up not being that good, then people voice their displeasure about it, then they most likely won't include it again. However, I don't see what the problem is with them trying something out first.

 

But why can't people voice their displeasure at something that has been shown off by the developers themselves and looks pretty fucking terrible for that matter? Isn't that the whole point of previews/general feedback/whatever?

 

What they should have done was introduce a beta, so that players could then at least try it out for themselves and offer some feedback to which they could make improvements to their product before release. Not announce it two months before release and expect everyone to be okay with it. They're just adding fuel to the fire here, like it or not.

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We have now all seen this http://www.xbox360achievements.org/game/tomb-raider-9/achievements/

 

FUCK! WHY.

 

MP in a tomb raider game. What is happening :(

 

did you say the same thing when they added MP to Assassin's Creed? i'm assuming your a fan.. that was another perfectly good SP game they threw MP on.. same with Dead Space (at least there were no achievements)

 

Add whatever crappy MP you want.. but don't add achievements to it if you (the developer) know it's gonna suck

Edited by Xenolith666
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What's wrong with TR wanting to be like a game that itself is a TR clone? \:|

Because they are (were) still pretty different. TR is (was) one of my favorite series, I've played every installment from the first to completion. Uncharted I couldn't even bother to finish 1 or 2 and never even tried the 3rd. Hated the characters (mostly), hated the decreased emphasis on puzzles and exploration, hated the cover based shooting, the overemphasis on QTE and making platforming 'cinematic', and definitely couldn't even fake interest in the MP.

 

Everything points to TR now ripping off exclusively the things I hate about Uncharted and shedding exclusively the things I always loved about TR. Is it objectively "wrong" in the scheme of things? Probably not, it might even be good for their bottom line--but it definitely is subjectively horrible for me, and unless I'm knocked off my feet in (positive) surprise when I rent it, it's the death of one of my top ten all-time favorite series.

 

MP is just one symptom of it, and MP cheevos just one indication of how many fucks Crystal Dynamics doesn't give about a certain group of longtime fans. IMO. But I'm not going to begrudge MP/Uncharted fans their enjoyment. I'm just going to be very sad (and possibly melodramatic). :(

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To be honest, there is a massive market for multiplayer and the size of the online community makes it almost impossible to ignore trying a multiplayer aspect. There are always exceptions like Skyrim, Dishonored and such, but Mass Effect 3 wasn't hurt bu multiplayer and the single player campaign was still sublime. And it was always a single player franchise.

 

I think we tend to get a little too protective of our single player campaigns

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Yeah, but that's because COD, Goldeneye, Halo, being FPS, are better suited to a MP experience and are practically self explanatory. What do people normally associate Tomb Raider with? Hours of exploration in the single player, not gunning each other down in team deathmatch. There was no obvious demand for a MP unlike the games listed there.

 

There's a difference between trying something new and adding something that just doesn't belong.

 

There's been plenty of games that MP was not demanded for, yet it was included, and people actually ended up liking it. Also, adding a new mode to a game is trying something new. That wasn't a demand for MP in Mass Effect 3, yet a lot of people still play it, and a lot of people have ended up enjoying it.

 

I take it you've only been reading the complaints on the comments section on the main page? From what I've seen everywhere else, aside from that, most of the complaints have been geared toward the terrible hit-detection, only three game modes, five small ass maps and only 4v4 max players. Are these not valid complaints for some to voice their concerns?

 

Why are they are giving gamers a reason to attach any bad flack to the re-boot because of a lousy MP experience if it isn't up to scratch? If it hurts the game's reputation, it hurts the game's reputation.

 

There, and other places as well. There hasn't been really any comments on how they could improve the experience. They just want it taken out, and never brought up again. That's not constructive criticism, that's just 'OMG I don't want it, get rid of it!'

 

Also, once again, seeing as how the game isn't out, it's kind of hard to pinpoint exact problems that the MP might have. If it ends up having other problems, then yeah, there would be valid complaints.

 

My point was, resources that could have gone into single player experience have been siphoned away to develop the MP. That is my main concern here because I'm most looking forward that more than anything. I want the best single player experience possible with no shortcomings and no "if only they put more time into this" like-scenarios.

 

I understand that concern, but once again, it's an assumption. How do you know that they would've added more stuff to the SP if they had no MP? How do you know that they worked on MP alongside SP? Maybe they did MP after they finished everything with the SP? We just don't know.

 

Also, the MP hasn't seemed to the hurt the SP of the Uncharted franchise.

 

Yeah, but try saying that to someone else who takes achievements and completion very seriously. From their perspective, adding achievements for something that's supposed to be "optional" is like adding insult to injury for some because they feel like they're forced to play something they won't enjoy if they want to complete the game. That's the only way I can put it, really.

 

Okay, and since when should developers cater to just this one type of gamer? Developers should never ever cater to one type of crowd, they should be catering to gamers as a whole, for the most part.

 

If someone signed up to be a completionist, then they need to suck it up and stop complaining. If that's what they chose to do, then that's what they have to deal with. Me, I love achievements, that's why I'm on this site to begin with. However, if getting an achievement requires me to be completely frustrated, and playing a mode that I absolutely loathe, then I just don't see the point. It seems as though a lot of people forgot what gaming is supposed to be, fun. If I'm not having fun, what's the point?

 

Just because it looks like Uncharted, doesn't mean it will be as successful or play as well. At least the developers of Uncharted seemed to have put in a lot into the thinking process for implementing a MP, not just some half ass attempt. Uncharted 3 was far more ambitious with co-operative and competitive MP and had more than just three game modes. Tomb Raider's MP doesn't. It looks so tacked on it's as clear as day. That's what I'm trying to get at.

 

That's why you have to, once again, give it a chance, and wait for it to come out before judging it. I'll grant you, Uncharted does have more modes, now, but when it first came out, it didn't have a lot of modes. It did have co-op, but people would probably be complaining about that for this game as well lol

 

Smaller game modes aren't that big of a deal to me, because that's usually what happens in a MP game. Only a select few game modes have a lot of traffic, while the rest pretty much are a ghost town.

 

First off, I'm not dictating anything, Celtic. Secondly, I'm simply voicing my own view on what looks, to me, a tacked on, half assed attempt at including a MP mode into the franchise.

 

And Bungie were practically begged to include a competitive MP after the first Halo game. Again, it's almost self-explanatory for a FPS to include a MP in this day and age. What works in one genre doesn't equate to success and word wide approval in another. Nor does it ensure the online community will be as active either. How many people play, say, The Darkness online compared to your CODs, Halos and Battlefields?

 

Tomb Raider was already a household name with a big following without MP even before those games ever existed

 

That's not what I was getting at, I was getting at the points that have been made that 'MP is not needed in this game. Developers need to stop putting in MP and MP achievements.' That's basically dictating what developers should be putting in their games. There really is no rule(s) at all as to what certain games should be like, or what modes should be in certain game genres. Developers should be able to put in, and do what they want with their titles. They only time that it should be a problem is if said mode is not good at all, and falls flat.

 

My point about Bungie was that it was a different time back then. Nowadays you have people ranting and raving for almost every game with MP achievements. If Halo 2, when it first came out, had a bunch of those, people would be complaining about it, as they are right now with this game.

 

You're right, what works in one genre doesn't always work in the other ones. However, that doesn't mean it holds true for every single game in said genre. MP has worked in the AC series, when nobody thought it would, as an example. Hell, there are plenty of FPS titles with horrible multiplayer.

 

You're also right that Tomb Raider was already a household name. Maybe that's why they're trying something different with the series, seeing as how it's already a popular series.

 

But why can't people voice their displeasure at something that has been shown off by the developers themselves and looks pretty fucking terrible for that matter? Isn't that the whole point of previews/general feedback/whatever?

 

What they should have done was introduce a beta, so that players could then at least try it out for themselves and offer some feedback to which they could make improvements to their product before release. Not announce it two months before release and expect everyone to be okay with it. They're just adding fuel to the fire here, like it or not.

 

I agree, there should've been a beta, but do you really think that would've stopped the 'MP and MP achievements is not needed in Tomb Raider,' comments? It wouldn't have, no matter what measures they would take.

 

I have no problem with people voicing their displeasure about stuff, what I have a problem with is people doing it with horrible reasoning and about something that hasn't even been released to the public yet. Once again, I haven't seen many actual constructive criticism comments on how and what steps they could take to make this mode better than what it is. So far, you're the only one that I've seen that has put forth some actual specific problems with the mode itself.

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Collectable achievements harm a game enough (as it takes you out of the main experience searching around, looking at guides etc.) not only has this game got a shit load but they've added in random, pure luck multiplayer achievements and highest rank achievement. + rest of the list is boring as sin. Poor show devs.

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After having read all of these longwinded arguments and posts about the relevance of putting MP cheevos into what has always been historically a SP game, my decision is going to be simple. Avoid and play other titles to keep my completion rate up.

 

I'm going for Metro Last Light, hopefully Bioshock 3 will feature no MP cheevos and Dead Space 3 as new release titles. I may play this game in the future based on reports on how long it will take to grind out. But as a completionist I will avoid for now. I don't get as much time as I used to on the X Box. There are plenty of other SP and no online games out there to keep me entertained.

 

I vowed never to play and boost online MP modes after Wolfenstein, Quantum of Solace and Halo 3. All of these took hours and hours to do and was quite frankly a real pain in the arse as well as a time waste. Those pricks at Bungie even had the balls to ban people if they were boosting the cheevos.

 

This is why I have avoided the newer Assassins Creed titles.

 

I have played and completed to 100% every tombraider game since the franchise started back on the PS1. Its really sad to see a title that always boasted a wonderfully immersive SP experience being propped up by what I fear will be a shitty MP mode. I may be wrong, but Level 60. That's enough for me to say "Pass" and focus on other titles. I'm sure there are plenty of others out there that share my sentiments.

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Absolutely share your sentiments. I've become a completionist since getting back into achievements and so most games I will not play if I don't plan to complete them. There's too many great games I want to play that I can complete to need to worry about ones I won't.

 

I also refuse to boost any achievement. I think that's cheating and since not a soul cares about anyone else's gamerscore, I earn achievements for myself. If I boosted it it's a hollow victory. Like cheating at solitaire.

 

That means I'd have to play who knows how many hours of multiplayer that is clearly very mediocre simply to complete it. Not buying. I can't wait for the reviews to applaud the single player and eviscerate the multiplayer. Teach them a lesson about patching together multiplayer experiences no one wants.

 

They could have at least shamelessly copied Uncharted. That's apparently fun.

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did you say the same thing when they added MP to Assassin's Creed? i'm assuming your a fan.. that was another perfectly good SP game they threw MP on.. same with Dead Space (at least there were no achievements)

 

Add whatever crappy MP you want.. but don't add achievements to it if you (the developer) know it's gonna suck

 

Of course. I love assassins creed but MP was pointless however its not terrible. Dead space was a shit version of left for dead but I had no reason to play it so I didn't care got all my SP achievements for what is a fantastic game (Cant wait for ds3) Also the same with mass effect 3 but I was forced to play that! It was enjoyable for about an hour..

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