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Is ragequitting appropriate against a spammer in this game?


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Subject BK201, I understand what you mean but the difference here is how we feel about it. I do not accept this manner of play style nor would I ever refer to it as a stradegy. The game isn't perfectly balanced in terms of the characters but using Simple mode in Ranked matches and implementing win streak achievements to it only hurt the idea of a good Ranked match.

 

I have never supported quiting but could understand why a player being griefed with spam attacks would do so. What I have been trying to stress was that it isn't the intended way to play nor should anyone complaing about it be criticized for not knowing how to defend against it. It is not accepted in arcades or tournaments, it should not be so accepted in Ranked matches as it defeats the point of Ranking especially when the skilled players move to player matches.

 

Personally, I will fight any player and regardless of whether I win or lose I will leave negative feedback for Player Skill after the match to avoid frequently being paired against them if they simply spam.

Edited by DeltaKappaEcho
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There were too many whiny posts, so I didn't read past the first page... use M.O.D.O.K's barrier assist and spam back, use Chris's crawl move (d, d + H) and spam back, use Hsien-Ko's Henkyo Ki (b, d, db + atk) to reflect the projectiles back, or use any character that teleports and get in on them.

 

To sum it up, learn to play the game in it's entirety. Go to mission mode and play with every character. Go through arcade on very easy with everyone to not only get the achievement, but (more importantly) learn how everyone plays.

 

If you only want to play with the team of X, Y, and Z... well that's your choice to make. At least make the effort to learn all the options your characters have and at least think about maybe picking up someone to combat the spammers. I hate M.O.D.O.K., but his barrier assist is really useful against projectile spam. Luckily I love Hsien-Ko, Wesker, and Dormammu, and one of them is always on my team.

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If they get easy wins what does that tell us about your skills in the game?Just quit playing fighters if you cant handle the heat.

 

-What does getting easy losses by spammers say about my skills?

NOTHING

Spamming can get you pretty easy wins... If I see I'm up against a spamming n00b, why bother myself by trying to figure out a way to counter his spams?

I never quit in fair matches even if it means getting a defeat. I like to be fair and expect the same from others.

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-What does getting easy losses by spammers say about my skills?

NOTHING

Spamming can get you pretty easy wins... If I see I'm up against a spamming n00b, why bother myself by trying to figure out a way to counter his spams?

Dude.Just quit fighters.These are not your games if you fail to see that the problem is you who doesnt even bother to learn how to counter spamming.

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Nah... I don't bother with n00bs, that's all. ;)

 

Spoken like a true scrub... if you want to get better at fighting games, you have to change that attitude. If you're playing just for fun, ignore the rest of my post.

 

As mentioned before, David Sirlin wrote a great set of articles called "Playing to Win" where he pointed out that this kind of thinking is causing you to play a different game than your opponent. In your game, spamming isn't allowed. So you quit because he isn't playing by your "house rules". Rules, might I add, that he was never told about nor agreed to.

 

This kind of complaint has been around since 1993, and I don't see it dying any time soon. I remember the days when I would whine about fireball spammers... I was 12 and playing Super Turbo. You know what I did? Practiced. I wanted to get better. Now I've been going to local tournaments for a decade (won a handful) and still trying to get better every day. If this isn't how you look at the game, then by all means keep on playing for fun with your friends or online. Just don't expect everyone else to drop down to your level and play your house-rules-so-I-can-win-sometimes little kid game.

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I wouldn't claim that the player that doesn't spam is following "little kids rules" as it's usually the non-skilled childish player that cares more about the win then the actual sport involved that is playing like a kid. And it must be repeated, SIMPLE mode spaming (which this game supports in Ranked matches) is different then the previous games which actually required a common knowledge of the moves and the repeated execution of them without fail. The timing of hitting a ranged attack repeatedly allowed more time for counters then it does as simply one-button.

 

And the "rules" against spaming are generally common acceptance in tournaments and arcades so no one is in the wrong for expecting a player to participate in a match with more than a single attack over and over again because it wasn't the intention of the game to be played just like that.

 

The discussion isn't simply about losing to a spammer, it's about the lack of interest the match becomes because of how people will cheapen the experience.

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And the "rules" against spaming are generally common acceptance in tournaments and arcades so no one is in the wrong for expecting a player to participate in a match with more than a single attack over and over again because it wasn't the intention of the game to be played just like that.

 

Wrong, wrong, wrong, so wrong. Have you ever been to an actual tournament or arcade? This might come as a surprise to you... there are no rules in an arcade. Also, there have never been any rules against spamming in a tournament. If a player chooses to spam, they are free to. They won't win. Good players know how to get around spammers. As a matter of fact, if you lose to a spammer then you have no chance to win a tournament.

 

"It wasn't the intention of the game to be played like that"? That move was put in the game with the startup, active, and recovery frames that the developers chose. Those moves operate exactly the way that they want it to. YOU don't want the game to be played like that.

 

I do agree that Simple mode spamming is lame, and mindless. However, they lose 2 hypers and some other moves for choosing Simple. I am much more afraid of someone that actually knows how to play the game, and has access to the entire moveset.

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And the "rules" against spaming are generally common acceptance in tournaments and arcades so no one is in the wrong for expecting a player to participate in a match with more than a single attack over and over again because it wasn't the intention of the game to be played just like that.

LOL.

 

Now you're just making shit up.

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I have to say I've never heard of any well known tournament following a no spamming rule. Are you talking about your local scene or Gamestation tournaments? It's certainly allowed at all the big names like EVO, West Coast Warzone, Seasons Beatings etc- and the reason why it's allowed is because, frustrating or not, it's not an impossible style to overcome when you've practiced how to do so. If someone actually started raging and got physical about it, they'd simply get removed from the premises; the last tourney I went to was held above a bar, the security there was some right big bastards haha.

 

I'm going to need to play against some people who use Simple mode to find out why that's so bad, but Simple mode doesn't magically change the frame data on attacks- it shouldn't be any harder to overcome than someone in Normal mode who has 100% consistency at performing special moves (which pretty much most people should have, it's not like the projectile is a shoryuken motion which isn't a smooth roll), you surely can't do things faster in Simple mode because moves still have recovery frames. Not to mention anyone using Simple mode is likely less experienced in the knowledge of playing keepaway safely (making it easier to get in on than a person who knows when to stop), and they lack several attacks of their complete moveset for when you do get in and open them up. Lag's the only factor I can find Simple mode becoming really unfair in, and to be honest you shouldn't be playing laggy people whether they use Simple or Normal mode so that's moot. You're bound to get the occasional laggy match, but you can't blame the game's design for that (well, the game's netcode maybe :p).

 

As an aside, characters like Arthur were designed specifically to play keepaway, so it's not true to say the game wasn't designed to play a projectile war. Hell, before the game came out Seth Killian announced to everyone that there were intentional infinite combos placed in the game- you can't ban spamming but allow infinites, right?

Edited by Didi Mau
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I wouldn't claim that the player that doesn't spam is following "little kids rules" as it's usually the non-skilled childish player that cares more about the win then the actual sport involved that is playing like a kid. And it must be repeated, SIMPLE mode spaming (which this game supports in Ranked matches) is different then the previous games which actually required a common knowledge of the moves and the repeated execution of them without fail. The timing of hitting a ranged attack repeatedly allowed more time for counters then it does as simply one-button.

 

And the "rules" against spaming are generally common acceptance in tournaments and arcades so no one is in the wrong for expecting a player to participate in a match with more than a single attack over and over again because it wasn't the intention of the game to be played just like that.

 

The discussion isn't simply about losing to a spammer, it's about the lack of interest the match becomes because of how people will cheapen the experience.

 

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Edited by Zlacker318
wrong bold
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thats one thing i realized in SSFIV, i won nearly 80% of my ranked matches, then i went to a player match lobby and got my head kicked in.

 

Edit: don´t get me wrong, those were good fights, because you can improve your skills when fighting stronger players.

 

That is because good players hate ranked matches for numerous reasons. In any fighting game I have ever played a real challenge is always in the player matches.

 

To the OP: Spamming is not cheap, unfair, or anything else. It is probably very easy to stop too. Just learn how to get in. If you are using a character like storm fly over all the projectiles. I dont have the game yet so I cant give much else advice.

 

Also, ragequitting only throws you in with other ragequitters.

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And the "rules" against spaming are generally common acceptance in tournaments and arcades so no one is in the wrong for expecting a player to participate in a match with more than a single attack over and over again because it wasn't the intention of the game to be played just like that.

Since effing when?Have you actually ever seen how high level ppl play at tournaments?Even Daigo throws hadoukens like they are going out of style.

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@ didi mau

The difference in the time it takes to do things in simple isn't mind boggling, however if you're playing the same style of keep away, and using normal controls them being only a half second faster can screw you bad. Like I said earlier I have no problem with the style it's just the style combined with simple mode.

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After losing 5 straight, instead of raging out i just switched games. I know its a part of the game and if your good you can do something against someone spamming with sentinal and phoenix, but after matching up with the fucker 3 straight and not being able to double jump over / slide / shoot back enough to regain control of combat it gets pretty boring.

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  • 7 months later...

@EnkiduV3

 

Well, your post seems to imply that every single MvC3 player is interested in tournament play. Well, a not-so-well-known truth is no; not everyone is interested in tournament-level play - there are some who play purely for the fun factor the game gives them.

 

I am not one of these people - I mainly play to win, but my argument stands that tournament-level play is not everyone's thing.

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And the "rules" against spaming are generally common acceptance in tournaments and arcades so no one is in the wrong for expecting a player to participate in a match with more than a single attack over and over again because it wasn't the intention of the game to be played just like that.

 

Got to disagree bro, no offense to you but go find a couple of the video's from 2010's EVO and watch how bad JWONG disrespects a female tournie player. He literally does uppercut heavy with chris redfield about 14 times effectively pinning her in the corner under constant chip damage from the grenade. [ I don't remember this gal's name but considering her team and how good she was with them I had respect because she played all darkstalkers] but there's no rules in fighting games. Because if you really want to break down the nuts and bolts of fighting games EVERY single one of us has a "go to" combo that we know and use repeatedly for whatever reason.

 

 

I have a particular Akuma combo that I do because it's almost always safe when blocked, it zones through projectile, and it covers a good 1/2 of the screen. Watch PRO wolvieman players, they use the training mission [10 I think] that's been modified to include an X factor cancel into a second full string that ends in a hyper [ Will full clear every character except hulk IIRC] and I've literally seen tournament footage from evo where someone who doesn't know how to avoid that combo was smashed without ever touching the opponents wolvie Does that mean Wolvie player is a spammer since he used the same combo repeatedly??

 

 

simply put you can complain about spammer's and whatnot but like everyone has said there is almost 95% of the time [ depending on your team] a solid counter to those movies. I run into Dante/Ironman/Captain America spammers quite often. And I generally will use Akuma's beam hyper or I will use his lvl 3 teleport hyper move because Akuma's level 3 hyper is invincible for just long enough to go through the spammable moves.

 

 

So you can complain about the sportsmanship of spammers all day and night, but if they know they can win via that. Then good for them and I hope I keep running into them because it's actually more fun for me to beat those spammers who have insane W-L records by doing Akuma's demon flip cancel'd into a beam or whatever works. Sooo my two cents is to not ragequit because it is a pain in the rearend when you get on that ragequit list [ happened to me because my 360's ethernet port started failing and would D/C me every five to ten minutes.] but no offense there's no "unstated rules" at any tournament because when it comes right down to it you play competitively to win and make the paper that comes with it; and if you lose you hopefully get better.

 

Btw at our local tournaments the only rule that's given before the matches is this "IF you accidentally hit the guide button or playstation home button you are warned. If the Tournament director [ or any observer] Witnesses you intentionally hit that button You will be disqualified."

So what does that say about which is worse?

 

I'm not trying to attack anyone in this thread particularly because I read through most of it but I kind of wanted to throw my piece of the cake into the circle.

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Whatever happened to having pride in your game? I hate the mentality that exists now days, "when however you can." It is cheap to use the same old crap over and over again. Sure it works, but for gods sake have some pride. If you think you are good because you can spam the same move over and over then you are delusional. Play and beat someone straight up with combos and plenty of moves. Or just be the problem that plagues the online for this game.

 

Could not agree more!

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