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Is rampant achievement accumulation ruining achievements?


ICeccoI
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As we all know achievements act as a reward for investing effort into a game. Achievements are satisfying to obtain as you watch your gamerscore progressively increase. I often like to get as many achievements as I can in each specific game, as it makes me feel like I am extracting maximal value from each game. Achievements give you a reason to revisit a game, for example replaying single player games on the next difficulty or completing challenges etc.

 

However i am concerned that our collective efforts to accumulate has stripped achievements of this purpose and now the goals of gamers is accumulation efficiency. We now look for the "Minimum number of plays through"

 

Checking the achievements before playing and using guides before trying not only seems akin to giving up on your own ability to complete the achievement requirement but also distracts from the game itself, which is meant to be entertaining but instead becomes a chore. That feeling of "I need to find all these collectibles" or "I need to do these specific level achievements so i minimise playthroughs", can take priority rather than just enjoying the game.

 

I also find distaste in "boosting", I realise that online achievements often require repetition, sometimes unreasonably so, but is there anything really fun about beating up your online friends vacant controller again and again?

I think online achievements are very different to offline but it does remain that accumulation is the main focus.

 

Next game i buy, im going to try beating it through once first without sneaking a peak at the rewards. Then after i revisit it, ill try to get more achievements.

 

Im really curious to see how the Xbox360 achievement community feels about this.

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IMO people who buy games purely to get all the achievements clearly have no life beyond their Xbox.

 

I mean, I'll admit I've just ordered Truth or Lies on Xbox 360 purely for the achievements, but overall, if I get an achievement in a game, I'll go "oh cool!" and then go back to doing whatever, getting achievements is NOT the be-all and end all of my 360 gaming, I play cos I enjoy the games.

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IMO people who buy games purely to get all the achievements clearly have no life beyond their Xbox.

Thank you for making the most generalized, false statement about achievements this year. Congratulations, sir.

 

http://oi14.tinypic.com/8fod2tg.gif

 

Anyway, OP seems to be saying that by mere nature of wanting to get all the achievement points, we are all automatically disqualified from enjoying the game.

 

What if a good part of my enjoyment of a game is actually getting the achievements? Honestly, for me, that's how it is. I don't have the time to play games more than once or twice (if it's really, really good) but I still want the achievements. So I do my best to get them all at once. If I don't, chances are I will not go back, because I have another game that I need to play. With 2 - 3 games coming out per month that I want to buy, a full time job and a family, I don't really have time to spare to be playing games two or three times through. As of right now, I have two games from gamefly that I haven't even touched after having them for a week, because I'm still working on finishing some other games.

 

So what if I look at a guide? Does it cheapen the experience for me? Nah. I like the guides on this site, because they allow me to see what I need to do, without having to follow a step by step walkthrough like you'd find on gamefaqs (which DOES cheapen the experience to me....)

 

Everybody is different. To say that you feel the game experience is cheapened for everybody by achievement whoring is simply a false generalization. I play games how I want, and you play them how you want. That's the best part about games. We do what we want.

 

If you don't enjoy the way you are playing, then stop playing that way. It's a pretty simple and obvious solution to the problem.

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Personally I have to disagree. I have Gamefly because I can't afford to buy all the games that I want, and while some are on that list solely because of achievements, the vast majority of games are on their because I thought they would be halfway decent. I also don't look at the achievements the first time through a game. After I finish the game and enjoy it enough I go through with the intent of getting all the random achievements I missed the first time. Achievements are nice but they aren't the reason I play games anymore.

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What a completely false and stupid comment.

 

Not really, if games are purely a source of gamerscore (as they seem to be for some people) then the people have missed the point of the game entirely and have acquiring gamerscore as their job, not a hobby. If, on the other hand, playing for enjoyment is the foremost goal, and achievements are a reward (or an enticement to try the game), then it is a different story. I've played a lot of games for gamerscore, but I did enjoy playing most of them.

 

OT: No, I don't think going for achievements has defeated the system. I check the road map before hand, more to see what is missable, what is glitchy, how long it will take, etc, but I will still play for fun. Playing Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2 right now, at one point I decided to stop stressing about the achievements and began grinding pretty quickly to get it out of the way. It allowed me to sit back and enjoy the game. Same thing with level replays. Only did it after the game was finished. I also like to have a non-spoiler collectables guide open, too, since it can be a real pain in the ass trying to track down the one you listed on a list of 200. Just saves my sanity at the end of the game.

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Ideally, a game should have easy, medium and hard achievements. The hard ones should not be a matter of consulting a guide to track down an ingame object or whatever, it should be a real challenge that requires a lot of practice to overcome, without being a tedious exercise of trial and error.

 

Because of boosting and Gamerscore whoring, I don't see GS as something to be proud of. Rather, the full 1000/1000 of challenging games is a better indication of skill and perseverance, and dedication to the game.

 

Personally, I play the game through first without caring about achievements. Then I look at a guide, decide whether to replay for the achievements and plan accordingly. Achievements definitely increase replayability value of some games for me.

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I do look at achievement lists before I get games, even on games I know I'm defiently going to play. It never stops me buying the game. For example before Devil May Cry 4 came out I looked at the achievement list and knew from the start it was going to be tough.

I buy the FIFA games every year and look at those achievements before I get it too. Why? I don't know, just to see what the game's like I suppose, but It never puts me off of a game. If I see an achievement that is very challenging I go for it as its more satisfiying when you complete it rather than just not buying the game at all.

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Haha I think its pretty funny that someone with only 2 posts on this site is raising all this hell! :D People just play what you want and play how you wanna play! Personally I play for fun and Gamerscore :), and I think we're all guilty( if not most of us) of playing at least one game for that sweet, sweet Gamerscore :) So theree's no need to say someone has no life or anything of that sort. So like I said in the beginning, people just play how YOU like to play! And just ignore the Gamerscore haters! :D

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i sort of agree with the tc and sort of dont

 

i buy games because i like them and want toplay specific games. i will admit i check out the list briefly before hand and have a vague idea of what they are.

 

i play it once for fun. looking at the guide at this point to make sure i dont miss any missable ones.

 

after i will get the guide up and start doing what needs to be done for the 1k. which i enjoy just as much as playing the game.

 

i would never buy a crap game for an arbituary score. And i dont go yay dlc which adds this gs. i play them to complete all the achieves as a completionist stance. i prefer completing games to 1000 where the game is considered hard rather than games that just give them to you.

 

As for boosting. i find it very dull like you say but i prefer it over wasting so much time on multiplayer which i really dont like all that much in most games and just wish it was a rule that multiplayer wasnt used for achievements. i'm sure leaderboards are enough.

 

i never feel achievements ruin the fun aspect of my gaming. it adds a different kind of enjoyment after the fun playthough has ended

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I think you should play how you want to play. If that means using a guide so you don't have to play it over again, that's entirely up to you. If you'd rather play the game and hunt for everything yourself, that's also fine. As long as you're not gamesaving and it's not effecting anyone else, it's your life and your time use it however suits you best and awards you the most entertainment. If it's a single player experience nobody should tell you how you should enjoy it, that's why it's single player and not single + peanut galley player.

 

I personally don't use guides until after I'm done with my first play through then if I feel like it go back and get whatever I missed (really depends on how much I liked the game). I will look at the achievement list once before playing though.

 

Multi-player is another thing. I don't enjoy multi-player so I don't play much of it but from what I hear there are a lot of achievements that have people playing a certain way just to get an achievement and ruining everyone's good time because they don't play the game how it's intended and only go for achievements. I think that's mostly the developer's fault though. If they just make simple multi-player achievements that come from just playing the mp (ie - play and finish X rounds of death match or kill X amount of people) or no mp achievements at all it would probably be better.

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I dunno, considering the standard for "easy 1k" is less than 15 hours, I don't agree with the whole "your priorities are wrong" viewpoint. That's not even a weekend for some of the members here (mostly the younger crowd) so it's still easily a hobby.

 

I don't even do the whole achievement whore thing anymore (quit in April), but unless it's actually getting in the way of an education or a career then it's nowhere near a priority that needs to be reconsidered. I happily rented the easy 1k's with the sole design on raising my gamerscore, because I wanted a higher gamerscore at the time. Most of the highly rated games I find are no better than the shitty ones, though I fully expect that to be in the minority's opinion.

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Not really, if games are purely a source of gamerscore (as they seem to be for some people) then the people have missed the point of the game entirely and have acquiring gamerscore as their job, not a hobby. If, on the other hand, playing for enjoyment is the foremost goal, and achievements are a reward (or an enticement to try the game), then it is a different story. I've played a lot of games for gamerscore, but I did enjoy playing most of them.

 

OT: No, I don't think going for achievements has defeated the system. I check the road map before hand, more to see what is missable, what is glitchy, how long it will take, etc, but I will still play for fun. Playing Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2 right now, at one point I decided to stop stressing about the achievements and began grinding pretty quickly to get it out of the way. It allowed me to sit back and enjoy the game. Same thing with level replays. Only did it after the game was finished. I also like to have a non-spoiler collectables guide open, too, since it can be a real pain in the ass trying to track down the one you listed on a list of 200. Just saves my sanity at the end of the game.

Same way, I don't actually read the guides themselves until after I beat the game, but I check the roadmap for key information like missables/collectibles/difficulty/time spent etc.....

 

Hell for fable 3 I turned off notifications because I didn't want achievements interfering. I played the game the way I wanted and I figured out most of the stuff on my own, now that I have had my fun I am going back with a collectibles guide and finishing off the game. Once I get around to fixing my computer......

 

@Richxbox360 I very much have my priorities straight. I work full time, going to college getting decent/good grades; I come home and play games for achievements. I have fun doing it, if its a chore like some of my completionist friends treat it then yeah I kinda agree. As gaming is a hobby not a life style, and those that treat as such need some sun and pussy.

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I find this thread slanderous, crude and impossible to deny! LOL jk.

 

To think that anybody who goes for gamerscore (whores as we are branded) have no life from our xbox, is just narrow minded. Mostly because most of us are just regular people who do it for a hobby. I will concur that there is some people who disregard life (work, school, family, chores) to sit and gain achivements but then you could regard that to anything but certainly isn't the majority of us.

 

I try to 100% most of my games because i enjoy the game and i love putting more time into it by getting the achivements not because i just have to have that omfgbbq 100% by habbit and ill miss work just to do it.

 

To the OT, while boosting in some games is unacceptable (Killstreaks in CoD) it just has to be done in some games that have dead online.

 

I check the road map for any game before i buy it simply because i like the idea i know if some achivements can't be gotten or how many/where the collectables are. I do somtimes think they go over kill on collectables, but the guide is somtimes essential (I'm looking towards Naruto RoaN here)

Anybody who has played that will tell you how much that game almost screams for a guide.

 

The bottom line is that, if you don't want to get achivements then don't nobody is making you. Fact is that you can play how YOU want too. Not how others.

 

-GD

Edited by Gareth Dent
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Not really, if games are purely a source of gamerscore (as they seem to be for some people) then the people have missed the point of the game entirely

 

Actually, no. Many people don't realize that games weren't just made for enjoyment. Yes, that's what they're used for, but it is very important to remember why the player is playing the game. You have a few reasons:

 

  • For learning and growth
  • Fantasy fulfillment and exploration
  • For exercise or relaxation
  • Sense of Satisfaction, accomplishment or acknowledgment
  • Exploring avenues that are not socially respectable or approved
  • Social function

These were taken from my 60+ pages of notes from when I was in Game Design & Development 101, which I just finished two days ago in my first semester in College. I got an A. But that's besides the point...

 

As you can see, games were and still are being made for several reasons. I highlighted the one I feel best deals with this issue. Sure, achievements haven't been around since the beginning of gaming, but some sort of challenge and a sense of achievement has been. If you feel satisfied from getting all of the achievements in a game, then the game did what it was exactly supposed to do. Just because you see a relaxation in just playing and feel that it retracts if a player spends too much time trying to get a special item or achievement, doesn't mean that he's playing the game the wrong way, just differently.

 

Plus, just aiming for achievements might not seem like a 'chore' or 'job' for them. If it's fun to do, or at least rewarding, then do it. If not, don't.

 

Edit: PS: This isn't just a tag against you Capn Doug, I kinda took the OP main topic and used your post as a starting point.

Edited by ITD Soldierboy
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Achievements have very rarely made me play a bad game (though if you look at my gamercard, you'll see a few dirty examples) but as far as I see, they're the second half of enjoying a video game. First is playing, beating and loving the experience...second is having proof of your accomplishments. Sadly some achievements are awkard or too easy to obtain (hit an enemy five times with your fist for example)...but the challenging ones, such as beating a game on the hardest difficulty or scoring a really high score in a game make having the achievement worthwhile. It's good to brag about those little "badges", as I've taken pride in badges ever since the Pokemon Red and Blue days X_X;

 

I'm not saying me obtaining a high gamerscore or a lot of achievements will earn me any sort of reward aside from accomplishment (though for some, it leads to fame...for others, it leads to people calling them hackers or whores), but I love these things nonetheless. Especially when I complete a game with all achievements, that means I beat the hell out of it and I didn't look back.

 

It's for my personal admiration...I'm proud of what I've done and to shift through my list of achievements to see these completed games makes me happy.

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Actually, no. Many people don't realize that games weren't just made for enjoyment. Yes, that's what they're used for, but it is very important to remember why the player is playing the game. You have a few reasons:

 

  • For learning and growth
  • Fantasy fulfillment and exploration
  • For exercise or relaxation
  • Sense of Satisfaction, accomplishment or acknowledgment
  • Exploring avenues that are not socially respectable or approved
  • Social function

Edit: PS: This isn't just a tag against you Capn Doug, I kinda took the OP main topic and used your post as a starting point.

 

Didn't take it negatively, though I think you missed my point (many people actualy do when I say games are purely a source of gamerscore). There are a few people out there who will play the game just because it gives them gamerscore. I freely admit, that there are two or three games on my tag that are nothing more than 1000 gamerscore to me. I hated pretty much every minute of Terminator Salvation and Backyard Football. I didn't go in expecting to, though.

 

The distinction needs to be made between playing for fun and playing for points. Part of the fun of the game is getting achievements, but if there is no enjoyment from the game itself (heck, I even enjoyed Jumper on some levels, felt like I should pop in another quarter when I died), can a sane and well adjusted individual truly find fun in nothing more than 1000g? That is the distinction that I try to get people to see. It is the same with DLC. People complained that they were forced to buy the Dragon Age DLC when it only gave them 50g or 25g. They missed the point that you have fun little side quests to do in order to get that 25g or 50g.

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It seems this achievement community acknowledges that there is an extreme and minority type of gamer who buys easy 1k games and some have admitted to a bit of "whoring" themselves.

 

However the majority are saying that aiming for achievements, have not reduced or distracted from games as an art-form, which is very positive.

 

Achievements can be addictive but so long as we're mindful of that we can continue to enjoy them.

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