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Old 05-10-2013, 04:08 AM   #1
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How halo 4 ruined the series

First off I would like to say that I have been a huge fan of the series and especially all the backstory behind spartans but Halo 4 kind of ruins it for me at least in the multiplayer. Many of the things about Halo 4's multiplayer would have made it a success: classes, abilities, and loads of weapons. The things that kills it is that there is no variation in what players use overall, you can get into a game and 80% of players all use the standard dmr, boltshot, mobility deal. I think that it just ruins the game in general when everyone uses the same thing because if you stray from that you lose no matter what. Have you ever seen an Ar beat a DMR and win the match whole team using full auto weapons vs. precision? Absolutely not. My main point is this I just think if they got rid of all precision weapons in loadouts the game would be much more enjoyable and the battles would actually be close. Opinions?
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Old 05-10-2013, 12:03 PM   #2
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EDIT: This thread is completely subjective on the basis of Halo 4 being bad because of certain weapons being used more frequently than others in your Multiplayer experience.

I should have read the whole thing before thinking this thread was about the series as a whole.
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Old 05-10-2013, 12:10 PM   #3
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So Halo 4 ruined the series because everyone uses the same gun... Right...
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Old 05-10-2013, 02:07 PM   #4
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I was hoping that this was about the series as a whole, and not just an opinion about weapon use in multiplayer of Halo 4.
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Old 05-11-2013, 01:48 AM   #5
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While I agree with you that it sucks playing a game when everybody just uses the same weapon over and over every match, I feel I must inform you that it did not ruin the series as this has been an issue that has been present in every Halo game since the beginning.

Halo 1: M6D Pistol
Halo 2: BR55 Battle Rifle / Type-51 Covenant Carbine
Halo 3: BR55HB SR Battle Rifle / Type-51 Covenant Carbine
ODST: Type-51 Covenant Carbine / M6C SOCOM Personal Defense Weapon System
Halo Reach: M392 Designated Marksman Rifle / Type-31 Needle Rifle
Halo 4: M395 Designated Marksman Rifle / BR85HB SR Battle Rifle
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Old 05-11-2013, 11:54 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkReign2021 View Post
While I agree with you that it sucks playing a game when everybody just uses the same weapon over and over every match, I feel I must inform you that it did not ruin the series as this has been an issue that has been present in every Halo game since the beginning.

Halo 1: M6D Pistol
Halo 2: BR55 Battle Rifle / Type-51 Covenant Carbine
Halo 3: BR55HB SR Battle Rifle / Type-51 Covenant Carbine
ODST: Type-51 Covenant Carbine / M6C SOCOM Personal Defense Weapon System
Halo Reach: M392 Designated Marksman Rifle / Type-31 Needle Rifle
Halo 4: M395 Designated Marksman Rifle / BR85HB SR Battle Rifle
Ohh! Getting all technical

And wow...I completely forgot/miss the Needle Rifle.
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Old 05-18-2013, 05:06 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkReign2021 View Post
While I agree with you that it sucks playing a game when everybody just uses the same weapon over and over every match, I feel I must inform you that it did not ruin the series as this has been an issue that has been present in every Halo game since the beginning.

Halo 1: M6D Pistol
Halo 2: BR55 Battle Rifle / Type-51 Covenant Carbine
Halo 3: BR55HB SR Battle Rifle / Type-51 Covenant Carbine
ODST: Type-51 Covenant Carbine / M6C SOCOM Personal Defense Weapon System
Halo Reach: M392 Designated Marksman Rifle / Type-31 Needle Rifle
Halo 4: M395 Designated Marksman Rifle / BR85HB SR Battle Rifle
Beat me to it! Hell if anything, overuse of one ore two weapons is a staple of the series. I always looked at this as kind of a plus. In 2 when everyone was running around with a BR, the last thing they were expecting was a plasma rifle / SMG combo and it would shred them to bits. Same goes for 4 - I see the surpressor once in a damn blue moon and it tends to throw me off enough that whoever is using it gets the better of me.
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Old 05-18-2013, 06:50 PM   #8
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So Halo 4 ruined the series because everyone uses the same gun... Right...
Seems like a legit reason for me.
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Old 05-19-2013, 04:06 AM   #9
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This is the series where one weapon has always been more dominant than the rest. Only difference is that Halo 4 has more choices
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:56 AM   #10
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I didn't like the Multiplayer, but I loved the Single Player. I can understand what you're saying with the weapons.
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Old 05-19-2013, 04:19 PM   #11
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I didn't like the Multiplayer, but I loved the Single Player. I can understand what you're saying with the weapons.
Halo's Single Player always triumphs! Except in Reach, the story was fucking lame.
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Old 05-24-2013, 07:16 AM   #12
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Halo's Single Player always triumphs! Except in Reach, the story was fucking lame.
Loved the Reach story personally, only Halo ODST had a lesser story to me... With Halo 4 they really hook me on the halo mythology with all the backstory(spartan ops, movies and such) they made.

As for MP, bah... never was a huge Halo MP guy, but i think H4 is in the continuity of all the other halos.... i mean i like to play on ocasion, for fun, but never was a competitive person on that game, i always tough Halo was extremely casual in term of MP(but thats my personal opinion) and i think H4 just follow the same way of the other one. But again... i feel the same way as the OP about GOW Judgment.. and yet a casual could think GOWJ is the same pretty much as GOW3 or the other GOW, but since i played GOW at a high lev since the first game, i personally see those changes and all.
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Old 05-25-2013, 01:50 AM   #13
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Halo started out as a pretty serious multiplayer scene in the H1/H2/H3 days, as the extreme level of MLG support has proven, but with the changes they've made in H4 and Reach, a lot of people really feel like it's lost it's competitive edge.

Myself personally, I'm ok with that. The less competitive a community is, the more fun it is to actually play. I enjoy the more casual social environments to the edgy competition even if I'm not personally fond of the changes they've made to the series (though honestly, Halo 4 isn't as bad as people make it out to be. I just think it was the maps that really bogged down the MP. It would have also been nice having a classic alternative to all of the Infinity gametypes with weapon spawns on map rather than ordinance and loadouts. A little bit of everything for everyone would've seen a lot more success for this game.
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Old 05-26-2013, 02:17 AM   #14
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Halo started out as a pretty serious multiplayer scene in the H1/H2/H3 days
Never saw Halo as much as a serious competitive MP to be honest. Not saying it aint fun, it is, but its a very casual game, with all the stuff there is in it, how it takes a shit load of bullet to kill somebody, how the vehicules where always part of the fun. To me Halo is the ultimate fun MP for casuals...
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Old 05-26-2013, 03:25 AM   #15
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Halo 4 SP was the best in the series. Easily.
Halo 4 MP I can see where fans of the past may not appreciate, but personally, I enjoyed it the most.
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Old 05-26-2013, 04:18 AM   #16
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Halo 4 SP was the best in the series. Easily.
Halo 4 MP I can see where fans of the past may not appreciate, but personally, I enjoyed it the most.
While Halo 4's SP was brilliant, I think Halo 2 still beats it for me. Only because there were multiple antagonists to focus on and the split play between two main characters was great.
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Old 05-26-2013, 07:27 AM   #17
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While I liked the personalization of some characters and enjoyed have a target to focus on, the actual boss battles themselves is what ruined it for me in Halo 2. When coming off of Halo 1's approach of "superior firepower vs superior strategy" having the "Shoot them in the weakspot when their defenses are down" boss fights really bothered me. Fortunately 'Telcam was a reasonable enemy to kill, the Scarab wasn't a boss fight no matter how much people claim it was, Truth was glitched to die in 10 seconds, and Tartarus was the only boss fight that truly screwed up the overall flow of the game. The H3 Chieftains were much more well done. I even enjoyed the little fight club moment at the end of Silent Cartographer. One of the few moments in the campaign that were really memorable.

Halo 4 still had it's primary antagonists (except 'Mdama wasn't even in the bloody campaign at all) but they mostly stayed out of the limelight and we focused on the armies themselves like the original Halo had us doing.
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Old 05-26-2013, 08:04 AM   #18
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Been so long i did Halo 2, but i remember the ending really left in a feeling of " did they forgot 1 quarter of the game on my DVD" ? I hate cliff hangers like that. Always hated cliff hangers on tv and movies, but in a game its just unnaceptable to me.

Especially that game... i was so pumped up, Chief comes to earth and it get you all exited and then bam... it cuts... WHAT !!!!?

And then the beginning of Halo 3 was not what i had in mind for the ending of Halo 2. I mean H3 was super great overall, don't get me wrong, i just mean its the problem with cliffhangers, they get you pumped up crazy in a way of "yeah, lets see that super great ending" but then when it resume, since its a new "movie/season/game" it start really slow...

Exemple : At the end of Halo 2 i tough chief was gonna drop out on earth, rampage the covenants and make them flee. But when Halo 3 started, you fall down... your discovered by Johnson and then the game start like any other games, slowly showing you the bases of the game and all.

Its like the show Supernatural, every season they end in a bang, yet when it resume its like either "3 months later" and your like "ok... " or they resume on what happened, it last 1 scene or 2, 1 episode at best, then bam the story arc is concluded and next episode is a filler... At that point i rather had the first episode part of last season...

Anyway its my feeling toward them, so lets say Halo 2 even tough i enjoyed it as a whole, left me a sour taste back then...
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Old 06-03-2013, 02:57 PM   #19
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OP isn't strictly correct, but fully customisable loadouts, (spawning with stickies and PP's, etc) ruins the game because vehicles are toast and so many players throw panic stickies before they died...

And Slayer pro is a sad excuse of a 3/Reach standard loadouts... No radar, no map weapons, etc

And the lag is ridiculous, every game lags near enough for no good reason...

Haven't quite made up my mind, but the weapon tuning seems cr#p in some aspects.
Like 100% movement speed (not needed), BR is now too powerful, slow down its ROF a bit more, and the lightrifle is a joke. Does extra dmage when zoomed in? No worries there, but now it fires faster, its a slightly less powerful sniper...

Think I'm going to call it quits on Halo 4 soon...
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Old 06-23-2013, 02:43 AM   #20
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I think that the whole loadout crap ruined the game.

IMO the maps are terrible and they need the Halo 3 ranking system. I just hope the Halo 2 anniversary has its legendary online with it.
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Old 07-23-2013, 12:47 AM   #21
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I hated the single player. The whole "this has all been planned out from the dawn of time" take on things totally blew it for me. Now John 117 doesn't seem as bad ass, because he's now treading the same path Desmond took in Assassin's Creed.
I loved it all thinking he was just a super lucky, well trained bad ass. Now he's just a guy with better DNA than everyone.
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Old 07-23-2013, 01:10 AM   #22
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You all need to realize that this is 343a first game as a company! Bungie didn't start off halo with halo. Their first game was marathon durandal and it was god awful. The way I see it they did a fantastic job on this game. It's different from the halo we've come to love but give them a chance to get it right I bet by halo 6 it will get amazing and we will all take back what we said about halo 4.yes it did get boring fast but If they bring back true skill and dumb down the noob friendly gameplay it will be perfect we just need to give them time to figure this out
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:01 PM   #23
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As with a number of other posters, the story has always been the hook for me with Halo (and I particularly enjoyed Reach in that regard). Halo 4 has the weakest story and campaign of the whole series. It's boring and I just shrugged my shoulders at the end as I didn't care any more, which I really wasn't expecting.

Spartan Ops is a nice idea, but really isn't suited to solo play, it's much more fun in co-op. I would like to see Firefight return to the series. The multiplayer is OK, but it's never been the big draw for me so at this point I don't know how to feel about the inevitable Halo 5. It'll probably be the first Halo game I don't pre-order!
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:36 PM   #24
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Judging from the debate this has created I think it is safe to say that the Halo series is alive and well. Whichever game you play you will always have those that absolutely love it and those who detest it with a passion. Weapon balance always cause outrage, the shotguns in Gears and Defiance are prize examples but IMO it always boils down to the player feeling cheated that they aren't good enough and getting beaten by better players or they didn't think of sticking to a winning formula in the 1st place and can't understand why some people like using a rinse and repeat approach. I like to mix it up a bit but I also hate losing so I always steer back to the combination I get my most kills with. Above all else though you only improve with practise, I pick up a halo game after a couple of months playing other games and it takes me an hour to remember how to chuck grenades again.
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Old 08-21-2013, 04:09 PM   #25
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EDIT: This thread is completely subjective on the basis of Halo 4 being bad because of certain weapons being used more frequently than others in your Multiplayer experience.

I should have read the whole thing before thinking this thread was about the series as a whole.
I think there's more to it than just weapon's being bad, the person did say abilities too, personally myself I strongly believe halo 4 is the worst in the series but I love the lore, I just wish they had improved the gameplay severly because it effect's the gameplay in all game modes, make it's hard to enjoy.

Yes I may come off as a hater of the game while it being in my recent games but it's the latest Halo, well I try to tolerate it to a degree.
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:35 PM   #26
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Judging from the debate this has created I think it is safe to say that the Halo series is alive and well.
I wouldn't judge anything from any debate in any forum. 343i, in all their attempts and failings to try and correct their poor decisions and re-draw attention from abandoners, did far too little far too late. It took 343i until their February TU to address the boltshot's OHK distance as well as the wide-spread griefing issue of friendly vehicles not covered by friendly fire.

It wasn't until March's TU that the bugged Ordinance markers were fixed. It also took them until then to /finally/ add X-Markers to signify where teammates have recently died (which launched with several bugs that weren't fixed until May).

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Weapon balance always cause outrage, the shotguns in Gears and Defiance are prize examples but IMO
The only prominent weapon issue in Halo 4 I recall is the pre-patch Boltshot, which was entirely justified because it made no sense to have a loadout /secondary/ weapon able to outperform the UNSC Shotgun with a greater OHK distance.

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it always boils down to the player feeling cheated that they aren't good enough and getting beaten by better players
Uh, no. Players feel cheated because Halo's turned into a game of chance and "luck" than a game of skill. It used to be a testament to a player, their weapon and their knowledge of their surroundings. Granted there are plenty of times when players kill others due to their "skill", but that doesn't nearly apply for all the times a player kills another with an Ordinance power weapon that they called down just moments prior to snatching that kill. The skill gap between a Rocket user and a player with a BR can be as wide as possible.. but if the two of them meet in relatively CQC, the rocket user will more often than not come out as the victor, regardless their lack of skill. Halo 4, for the most part, became nothing but a chaotic, random multiplayer environment that focuses on instant gratification and not skill progression.

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I pick up a halo game after a couple of months playing other games and it takes me an hour to remember how to chuck grenades again.
It takes you an hour to remember that the left trigger (common in most FPS games) is used for grenades? Hm.

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I wouldn't say that Halo 4 ruined Halo; I would say that 343i ruined Halo. Time and time again they've worked at a snail's pace to address the issues and concerns of their playerbase.

Since the game's launch players have been /begging/ for a "classic" playlist. Slayer Pro was an improvement but it fell flat in many aspects. It took them until /July/ (8 months since Launch) to put out the Legendary Slayer playlist.. but in typical 343i fashion, they don't account for BR starts; hell, you don't even get a Pistol secondary with your Assault Rifle so you're perpetually at the mercy of the other team if they get a good handle on BR's and the map's power weapons.

The boltshot nerf. The addition of Big Team Skirmish. The issue of friendly fire. I don't know, it seems like with each and every promiment issue that concerned Halo 4, 343i went out of their way to take a long period of time to address them. And it's a shame too -- if they had only been prompt and relatively quick to address issues, Halo 4 would have a much healthier population than their paltry daily population of 25k -- many of their players have already jumped ship and all these progressive updates they've released recently will do little in regaining their attention -- as said earlier, it's too little, too late.

To put this in perspective, the rate at which players moved away from Halo 4 when compared to Halo: Reach is astoundingly much worse.. If Halo 5 is further CODified, I'm not too sure how many "core Halo fans" 343i will have left.



edit: But for the topic's sake, here's a few examples of how Halo: Reach and Halo 4 "watered down" the Halo experience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Before you ask, core principles of Halo include:

*Map control
*Teamwork
*Accuracy
*Awareness
*In-game ranks
*Staying alive
*and a few other misc things I'm sure I forgot.

Between Halo Reach & 4

*Removed map control with AAs
*Encourage lone-wolfing with the ranking system and instant respawns.
*Accuracy isn't required as much as it was instead the game has
*Nade spam
*Randomness due to ordnance and the quick power weapon respawns
*Friendly fire was turned off (might be back on now?)
*Awareness was replaced with
*Sprint (you can run away from situations you shouldn't have gotten yourself into)
*Nade indicators
*Weapon Spawn indicators
*Objective indicators (hill, flag, etc)
*Staying alive was replaced with instant respawns. Dying is now not punished.

Note that Reach only introduced a few of these things, Halo 4 furthered it.

The fact is, Halo 4 has abandoned many of those features that made Halo so enjoyable, addictive, competitive, and fun.

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Old 08-22-2013, 08:33 PM   #27
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To be fair, Halo 4 definitely decreased the level of grenade spam that Reach introduced. Too bad it did it by making frags hilariously weak.
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Old 08-23-2013, 02:11 AM   #28
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So because people use the same starting weapons the series has been ruined when the first second and third games all had the same starting loadouts as well?
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Old 08-23-2013, 02:29 AM   #29
Hishoa
 
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Originally Posted by Hot Juicy Pie View Post
So because people use the same starting weapons the series has been ruined when the first second and third games all had the same starting loadouts as well?
Yeah, OP's reasoning was pretty whack. While I agree that the franchise has been severely damaged, it's for different reasons entirely.
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Old 08-26-2013, 11:39 PM   #30
turbocrow
 
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I was hoping for the game to go back to Halo 2 type game. Sadly it never will Halo 4 is the first halo I never played past 3rd mission.
Only Halo game where I said I give up on the franchise.
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