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Old 09-19-2008, 03:15 AM   #1
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Why is Vader Such a Wuss in Episode VI - Spoiler Alert

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I have'nt got to the end but know that you need to beat Vader. Why is vader so super powerful in force unleashed and such a pussy in Episode IV.

In force unleashed he is a master with a lightsaber and shoots a massive force push cloud at you but in Episode VI, Luke loses his temper cuts Vader's hand and Vader is on the floor crying like a bitch.
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Old 09-19-2008, 03:19 AM   #2
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The easy answer: the technology wasn't nearly as advanced as it is today.
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Old 09-19-2008, 03:48 AM   #3
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The easy answer: the technology wasn't nearly as advanced as it is today.

i dont think he's talking about the special effects..
im pretty sure he's talking about why was vadar so weak in the episode. as in the character. whichh would mean all the technology is the same, well in star wars, not real life lol. dunno how much sense that makes but it makes sense too me. vadar is my fav star wars char and idk that kinda made me mad that luke smashed on him but idk he's like double luke's age, half his body is mechanical so that might have something too do with it. wish i knew
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Old 09-19-2008, 04:02 AM   #4
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My it's because they are .... 10 year older then before??

I think I've read somewhere that the gap between Ep3 and Ep4 is about 10-20 years... That'd make Vader (who is now a cyborg) about 40-50 ?



..erm... Yes, why was he such a pussy !?
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Old 09-19-2008, 04:50 AM   #5
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okay here is my take. general grievous is a early version of vader he was human at one point then was put into that suit and as you can tell it has taken a toll on him with his coughing and trouble breathing like vader, so when the emperor made vader with that suit it was a advanced version but it still a human being inside so time does effect him. Just look at obi one kenobi he was a little older then vader but when he fought him (vader) for the last time on the death star he had no wear near the skill he had when he fought him as anakin. The suite is just to protect him now to help him breath not give him cyborg powers he is strong with the force but the body is beat to hell. Thats just my thoughts.
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Old 09-19-2008, 05:35 AM   #6
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That does not account for Count Dooku and Yoda laying down major whoop arse on people ... and they were much older than 40.

The fact is that story telling and fight sequences were not Lucas' strong point and he is only left with relaying power through dialogue (again something he does poorly).


Don't forget that if you read the books it clearly states that Vader has been slowly healing himself ... to the point where he was able to breath without the suite (for very short periods). They touch on this briefly in some scenes
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Old 09-19-2008, 05:42 AM   #7
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yoda is not hunman so he is not bound by human standers and Count Dooku was just a kick ass old man lol but yes I have read the books wich are better then the movies I think, but it does not change the fact that vader is a very beat up person and Count Dooku was not. Vader needs the suit 99% of the time to survive Count Dooku does not he is still human and he does not need a suite to keep him alive like vader.
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Old 09-19-2008, 05:43 AM   #8
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Because he doesn't want to kill luke. He is holding back.

On a side note Grievous wasn't human.
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Old 09-19-2008, 05:46 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xRogue 5x View Post
Because he doesn't want to kill luke. He is holding back.

On a side note Grievous wasn't human.
Yes he was listen to the audio commentary on ep three dvd they talk about how he was the crude version of vader and how he is more machine then human.
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Old 09-19-2008, 05:49 AM   #10
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There is a big difference in idle talk on dvd commentary and cannon from a source book.

Grievous is/was a "Kaleesh" Warlord.

Edit* I found a pic but i'm pretty sure we're humans...and I don't think we look like this
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Old 09-19-2008, 05:54 AM   #11
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There is a big difference in idle talk on dvd commentary and cannon from a source book.

Grievous is/was a "Kaleesh" Warlord.
Damn lucas and his lackies lies I tell you lol My bad then thanks for info.
I should not argue with a jedi master.
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Old 09-19-2008, 07:29 PM   #12
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Because it's a video game and he's a boss fight. When before in Star Wars did you see someone pull down a Star Destroyer with the force?
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Old 09-19-2008, 08:04 PM   #13
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At any point did someone assume that on the dvd commentary that perhaps when they said more machine than human... They just meant more machine than flesh?
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Old 09-19-2008, 08:19 PM   #14
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You'll see when you get to the end really.
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Old 09-19-2008, 09:35 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by punisher View Post
** Possible Spoiler **

I have'nt got to the end but know that you need to beat Vader. Why is vader so super powerful in force unleashed and such a pussy in Episode IV.

In force unleashed he is a master with a lightsaber and shoots a massive force push cloud at you but in Episode VI, Luke loses his temper cuts Vader's hand and Vader is on the floor crying like a bitch.
For one, he's a lot older than what he is in Force Unleashed. There is, at least, a ten year interval between Force Unleashed and Episode 6. Second: the ending of Force Unleashed explains why he's weaker. Third: Its his son. He isn't able to kill his son, so he holds back. Fourth: The original trilogy was built for character development, not for OMFG FORCE PWN YOU! Or Yoda jumping around and kicking ass to then 20 years being almost unable to walk....
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Old 09-19-2008, 09:40 PM   #16
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Fourth: The original trilogy was built for character development, not for OMFG FORCE PWN YOU! Or Yoda jumping around and kicking ass to then 20 years being almost unable to walk....

just thought id throw that in there
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Old 09-19-2008, 09:47 PM   #17
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Vader is a wuss oh my mommy died im emo, my wife is cheating with me on obi wan im gonna kill you waah, ahh i got my legs and arms lopped off by obi and left to fry *Agonizing pain*, ahh i killed padme wahhhh *big crying scene*, hahaha pussy...

You know with out that machine voice box he would sound like a 2 year old girl since his nuts got melted by lava...
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Old 09-19-2008, 11:13 PM   #18
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Well on major reason vader may seem like a wuss in the original trilogy is that force push and grip hadn't really been invented yet. Only powers Lucas even had dreamed up was mind trick, lightning (which vader can't use anyways), choke, and foresight. Everything else was lightsabers.

All the other powers came from the new trilogy and the expanded universe.

Remember the original trilogy only had the original trilogy to pull from, lol.

The Force Unleashed had the new trilogy and the expanded universe as reference as well as the original trilogy.
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Old 09-24-2008, 12:47 PM   #19
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yes its stupid that as starkiller u beat vader i was pissed but overall a great game and vader is g and whoever said vader holds back against luke made a great point and the newer movies ould have made use of how lucas meant the force to be like but the movies story would not have made sence if the jedi were as powerful as in the gme so the force unleashed was a great way to show the forces capability
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:01 PM   #20
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My take on it was Vader was a wuss in The Force Unleashed. There was nothing really badass about him, his boss fight is so linear and predictable.

In the movies he was badass in Episode 5 but in Episode 6 he was just an old man who was in a moral dilemma. You could see even before the final fight he was having serious doubts about what he wanted to do. During the fight he was just a confused soul who was unsure on what he should do.

Plus add how Luke was younger and equally or more powerful than his father then you can see why Vader came off looking as a wuss. At the end of the day Vader is still badass in my book.
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:16 PM   #21
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Whys Vader weaker?

Have any of you played the Force UNLEASHED?!?!

I'm so shocked that none of you have put these facts which you have seen to explain why hes so much weaker in the old films...

Did any of you even see the fight between Vader and the Apprentice? did any of you see what he did to Vader near the end of the fight??

Well then... i suggest you replay that level and watch it, cause Vader got his assed kicked and nearly died...again

This was the one reason why the showed us this scene of Vader getting beaten the crap out of, after this fight he was a lot weaker beacuse he was really badly injured.. The Creators of the game did this for a CLEAR purpose...
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:19 PM   #22
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Jimmmz I did say that at the start of mines, Vader was a wuss in The Force Unleashed. However he is still badass in my book.

The game was meant to make Starkiller look more powerful than even the Emperor, check out the Light Side ending. So personally I still think Vader is badass.
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:26 PM   #23
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All good reasons,but there's one that I thought of that wasn't mentioned here :
He was out of practice in episodes IV-VI.He hadn't fought a real enemy in years,all he did was choking commanders and other officers to death if they didn't do their job right.While in the Force unleashed he's still hunting jedi so he's alot more active.Plus,his suit might have gotten rusty...
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:32 PM   #24
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All good reasons,but there's one that I thought of that wasn't mentioned here :
He was out of practice in episodes IV-VI.He hadn't fought a real enemy in years,all he did was choking commanders and other officers to death if they didn't do their job right.While in the Force unleashed he's still hunting jedi so he's alot more active.Plus,his suit might have gotten rusty...
Good reasons actually, I remember reading that Lucas had originally intended for Vader in Episode 3 to look different from the original costume but due to the outrage from fans he used the original designs.

My point being he probably would/did get upgrades as technology advances but I do agree about his fighting skills being rusty due to lack of use. I don't really see Vader and the Emperor being sparring partners in the years following TFU haha.

Was it me or did they kind of rip a hole in the canonical story as well when they removed Vader's helmet? In RotJ it is said that if Vader removes his helmet he will be unable to breathe and die. Yeah I know we have the scene in Empire when he's without his helmet but according to the story that machine basically does the job on a grander scale so no need for the mask.
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Old 09-24-2008, 02:01 PM   #25
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Someone may have said this already, but a reason Vader lost to Luke was because he knew Luke was his son, so he was holding back.

Another excuse is that with every injury his body became more and more machine, so the force had less and less substance to flow through, and so he couldn't use enough power.
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Old 09-24-2008, 02:21 PM   #26
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All good reasons,but there's one that I thought of that wasn't mentioned here :
He was out of practice in episodes IV-VI.He hadn't fought a real enemy in years,all he did was choking commanders and other officers to death if they didn't do their job right.While in the Force unleashed he's still hunting jedi so he's alot more active.Plus,his suit might have gotten rusty...
A rusty suit, LMAO
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Old 09-24-2008, 05:01 PM   #27
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yeah. vader was holding back. even in this game starkiller says "you didn't really want do destroy the emperor, did you?" and vader replies "yes...but now with you." probably meant luke, no?

also, i don't buy this "oh as humans get older they get weaker" or whatever. cause i'm sure it's not a rookie move to release yourself into the force like obi wan did in a new hope.
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Old 09-24-2008, 05:01 PM   #28
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In force unleashed he is a master with a lightsaber and shoots a massive force push cloud at you but in Episode VI, Luke loses his temper cuts Vader's hand and Vader is on the floor crying like a bitch.
Vader was older at that time, hadnt had much practice before Luke fought him, and you could say he was going easy on Luke cause he didnt want to kill him. he was mainly trying to get Luke pissed off so he would join the dark side, so he wasnt trying very hard. this is easy to see in any of their fights, you can easily tell Vader isnt trying very hard. he's only fighting hard enough to try to piss Luke off not hurt him (except for cutting his hand off).

where as in this game, he's obviously trying to kill the Apprentice.
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Old 09-24-2008, 05:04 PM   #29
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also, i don't buy this "oh as humans get older they get weaker" or whatever. cause i'm sure it's not a rookie move to release yourself into the force like obi wan did in a new hope.
yes, that isn't true. force connection would only be weaker if you are less human so there is less of you to channel it. Thus why Vader couldn't do force lightning, there wasn't enough of him left to channel it.
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Old 09-24-2008, 05:31 PM   #30
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No one know that some random bloke wrote 'The force unleashed' and its just another side story to the actual films.

No one realised around 20 people have written side star wars based books etc but this one was the best of the lot and was made into a game?

Honestly the game was good but no one should take this into consideration that this is actually what was meant to happen between films 3 & 4.

This is just someones theory basically. Go off and make your own theory, Im sure you can make it better then this. I mean the whole apprentice stuff is awesome but the endings and whatever is stupid.

The way I see it, between 3 & 4 Vadar hunts down the last of the Jedi as best as he can but obviously not all and then 4 starts with the 'New hope' for the Jedi's in winning the 'war'.

This game etc is just a random theory thats cool enough for Lucas to say 'Ok make it a game and I will take a percentage of the profits' lol.

Also everyone check out the youtube video lol, I never thought of it this way and Im not a massive star wars fan although do like the concept but that guy sums up the 3 later films up so easily lol.
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